The hard lesson I've learned from having two kids is that apparently all these things I've trained myself to "love" for three decades are all just methods to waste time. Kids take your time and the distractions become few and far in-between. I "miss" my distractions because I miss my time. But there is probably nothing more worthwhile that I could do with it than investing it in these fresh beings.
elp · 4h ago
Kids especially once the second one arrives kill your money, your sex life, your free time and they will probably destroy at least one item that has sentimental value to you.
Feel squeamish about bodily fluids? Don't worry the kids will cure you. Nothing like trying to do a Matrix style bullet time dodge when you are changing a nappy and the cold air makes your son let loose with a stream of pee.
And then they look at you and giggle and the world is perfect. Wouldn't change it for the word, but enjoy life first then have the kids. Its not worse just very very different and you can't go back.
windward · 5h ago
Parents, teachers and media spent a lot of time telling my having a baby would ruin my life. They didn't want me to be a teen parent. I get it.
But most of the scaremongering wasn't about teen parenthood. It was just about parenthood, and life once you have too many responsibilities to enjoy being a teen. So once you do reach the age that raising children is more responsible, you still have to get past the same fears.
Society has an irritating way of 'hazing' its juniors by telling them life keeps on going downhill. So far I've found the opposite, and that I'd be better equipped to handle it anyway.
JohnFen · 1h ago
Having a baby changes every aspect of your life. Some of those changes are good, some not so much. Whether it's a good or bad thing overall depends on you and your temperament.
invalidname · 22m ago
I usually say that having a kid is a form of suicide. Your old self needs to die and you should be OK with that.
People aren't happy if they yearn for the life they had before.
rich_sasha · 5h ago
It's interesting.
My most surprising observation about having children is that, although instinctively you think you'll be doing much much less fun stuff than before children, it's not actually true. Yes, there is a decrease, and you tend to be more tired. But even aside from whether children themselves are fun, I got much better at squeezing fun out of less free time. I'd say I do 80% of sports etc I did pre-kids. And then as the kids get bigger, they do become genuinely fun. I take mine climbing. It's not hardcore, more sweet and mellow, but it's fun.
What did massively change for me is relationship dynamics, but that's perhaps a different story.
comrade1234 · 3h ago
The pros in these lists always make me think that brainwashing is part parenthood.
captain_coffee · 2h ago
It literally is - your brain chemistry changes and you basically enjoying having children despite the fact that it is objectively unpleasant and net drain on all of your resources.
Subjectively you will feel good about it despite that due to your brain being hijacked into interpreting the whole experience as positive.
austin-cheney · 5h ago
In the long term the choice of mate is far more consequential than having children.
latexr · 6h ago
The list of pros made me cringe.
Yes, I’ve had a baby fall asleep on my chest. Personally I prefer when a cat does it.
Yes, I’ve seen a baby sneeze. It doesn’t even register in my top favourite things and definitely does not make up for the rest.
Yes, I make my friends laugh, and I’ve made them wheeze hard until they’re out of breath with clever ideas we can all build upon. If your friends are faking laughs around you and in a way you can’t tell, I’m afraid to say maybe they’re just acquaintances.
Yes, I’ve been stared at with “unfiltered love and wonder”. By an adult, who has reason to and does it out of genuine felt affection for the person I am and the things I do, not simply because I’m the person in front of them and they’re ignorant of everything around them.
And on and on. I could address literally every point.
Look, you do you. If you enjoy being a parent, more power to you. But this list doesn’t really “[contribute] to the debate” nor will it “help others make up their mind”, especially when the cons are clearly dishonest or at best uninformed by a fatherhood which hasn’t even spanned half a year yet. You’re either trying really hard to convince yourself that you like being a parent (which is a bad sign) or you’re genuinely so happy (good sign) that you just wanted to gush to the world. Which is fine, sometimes we just want to share what makes us happy and that’s positive, let’s just not pretend this list is in any way an honest attempt at conversation.
windward · 5h ago
There is no extracting the objective from the emotional when the very topic is the emotions it makes you feel. There can be no more honesty.
Cringing at the thought of expressing yourself isn't healthy.
latexr · 3h ago
> Cringing at the thought of expressing yourself isn't healthy.
That’s not what I said, and if you engage with my comment until the end in good faith you might realise that. I specifically said it is a positive for the author to share what makes them happy.
But “cringe” was definitely the wrong word and weakened what I was attempting to express. I had just came from that subreddit and failed to identify the correct feeling. This is not an excuse, the error there was mine.
> There is no extracting the objective from the emotional when the very topic is the emotions it makes you feel.
Then be honest about it and say you’re sharing your experience, don’t pretend to be making a list to “contribute to the discussion” or “help others make up their mind”. That’s my point. I was genuinely interested in the article until I realised it was just personal gushing. Which again, is fine, just be honest about it.
In other words, I completely agree with you. But what you’re defending the author for is not what they did.
reillyse · 5h ago
Nah, kids are great a real joy and I think he captures the joy of being a father in the post.
I’m two months in with my first child and I can honestly say I’ve never experienced love like this, it’s awesome and I feel everyone should get to experience it.
latexr · 3h ago
I believe you, and I even say as much in my comment. I’m not arguing kids can’t be great, I’m only saying the post isn’t what it claims to be (i.e. this is about someone sharing their happiness, not advancing the discussion).
Additionally, while I have zero question that kids are the best thing ever for some people, it’s important to recognise that is not a universal feeling. Which isn’t just theoretical, some people do have kids and are or became miserable. You lucked out, and I’m genuinely happy for you (and your kids, because having a happy parent will give them a better life).
In short, kids are not a universal experience in either direction and it’s nonsensical to claim that would be the case.
orwin · 50m ago
Yes. And it's dangerous presenting the joy of parenthood as universal, it put a lot of pressure.
One of my cousins had difficult pregnancies, and finally managed to have a kid around 10 years ago. Since basically COVID, when her child was around 6, she started fleeing her house, finding more and more stuff to do, quitting a balanced job to go into entrepreneurship that ate her days, and basically stopped interacting with her child. After a disaster (an ecological one), they had to come back last winter, and she finally broke down in front of her mother and aunts saying she doesn't love her child as much as she should, she doesn't feel any joy in parenting, that she is a bad mom and should have her child removed as she can't look at him without feeling guilty.
I'm pretty sure a honest description of what being a parent means, and people saying to her that you don't _have_ to feel the same as others before she hurt her relationship with her child would have been helpful (but well, spilled milk and all that).
My personal opinion is that people mostly lie to themselves then to others about what they really feel in general, so posts like this have no impact on my opinion (that said, children are great: the 4 month to 30month is a bit of a grind and difficult, but once they're past that its fun and games).
Feel squeamish about bodily fluids? Don't worry the kids will cure you. Nothing like trying to do a Matrix style bullet time dodge when you are changing a nappy and the cold air makes your son let loose with a stream of pee.
And then they look at you and giggle and the world is perfect. Wouldn't change it for the word, but enjoy life first then have the kids. Its not worse just very very different and you can't go back.
But most of the scaremongering wasn't about teen parenthood. It was just about parenthood, and life once you have too many responsibilities to enjoy being a teen. So once you do reach the age that raising children is more responsible, you still have to get past the same fears.
Society has an irritating way of 'hazing' its juniors by telling them life keeps on going downhill. So far I've found the opposite, and that I'd be better equipped to handle it anyway.
People aren't happy if they yearn for the life they had before.
My most surprising observation about having children is that, although instinctively you think you'll be doing much much less fun stuff than before children, it's not actually true. Yes, there is a decrease, and you tend to be more tired. But even aside from whether children themselves are fun, I got much better at squeezing fun out of less free time. I'd say I do 80% of sports etc I did pre-kids. And then as the kids get bigger, they do become genuinely fun. I take mine climbing. It's not hardcore, more sweet and mellow, but it's fun.
What did massively change for me is relationship dynamics, but that's perhaps a different story.
Yes, I’ve had a baby fall asleep on my chest. Personally I prefer when a cat does it.
Yes, I’ve seen a baby sneeze. It doesn’t even register in my top favourite things and definitely does not make up for the rest.
Yes, I make my friends laugh, and I’ve made them wheeze hard until they’re out of breath with clever ideas we can all build upon. If your friends are faking laughs around you and in a way you can’t tell, I’m afraid to say maybe they’re just acquaintances.
Yes, I’ve been stared at with “unfiltered love and wonder”. By an adult, who has reason to and does it out of genuine felt affection for the person I am and the things I do, not simply because I’m the person in front of them and they’re ignorant of everything around them.
And on and on. I could address literally every point.
Look, you do you. If you enjoy being a parent, more power to you. But this list doesn’t really “[contribute] to the debate” nor will it “help others make up their mind”, especially when the cons are clearly dishonest or at best uninformed by a fatherhood which hasn’t even spanned half a year yet. You’re either trying really hard to convince yourself that you like being a parent (which is a bad sign) or you’re genuinely so happy (good sign) that you just wanted to gush to the world. Which is fine, sometimes we just want to share what makes us happy and that’s positive, let’s just not pretend this list is in any way an honest attempt at conversation.
Cringing at the thought of expressing yourself isn't healthy.
That’s not what I said, and if you engage with my comment until the end in good faith you might realise that. I specifically said it is a positive for the author to share what makes them happy.
But “cringe” was definitely the wrong word and weakened what I was attempting to express. I had just came from that subreddit and failed to identify the correct feeling. This is not an excuse, the error there was mine.
> There is no extracting the objective from the emotional when the very topic is the emotions it makes you feel.
Then be honest about it and say you’re sharing your experience, don’t pretend to be making a list to “contribute to the discussion” or “help others make up their mind”. That’s my point. I was genuinely interested in the article until I realised it was just personal gushing. Which again, is fine, just be honest about it.
In other words, I completely agree with you. But what you’re defending the author for is not what they did.
I’m two months in with my first child and I can honestly say I’ve never experienced love like this, it’s awesome and I feel everyone should get to experience it.
Additionally, while I have zero question that kids are the best thing ever for some people, it’s important to recognise that is not a universal feeling. Which isn’t just theoretical, some people do have kids and are or became miserable. You lucked out, and I’m genuinely happy for you (and your kids, because having a happy parent will give them a better life).
In short, kids are not a universal experience in either direction and it’s nonsensical to claim that would be the case.
One of my cousins had difficult pregnancies, and finally managed to have a kid around 10 years ago. Since basically COVID, when her child was around 6, she started fleeing her house, finding more and more stuff to do, quitting a balanced job to go into entrepreneurship that ate her days, and basically stopped interacting with her child. After a disaster (an ecological one), they had to come back last winter, and she finally broke down in front of her mother and aunts saying she doesn't love her child as much as she should, she doesn't feel any joy in parenting, that she is a bad mom and should have her child removed as she can't look at him without feeling guilty.
I'm pretty sure a honest description of what being a parent means, and people saying to her that you don't _have_ to feel the same as others before she hurt her relationship with her child would have been helpful (but well, spilled milk and all that).
My personal opinion is that people mostly lie to themselves then to others about what they really feel in general, so posts like this have no impact on my opinion (that said, children are great: the 4 month to 30month is a bit of a grind and difficult, but once they're past that its fun and games).