This article is really low on actual facts about how these co-ops can actually operate.
I feel like the problem in the US isn't necessarily that the government won't directly pay for these kinds of things like they do in Switzerland, but that it's very very hard to finance a co-op, possibly illegal (that is, you wouldn't have the same legal protections a condo does).
I would be curious to see the finances of the buildings they mention in the article. Assuming that you could arrange the two major financial aspects: 1) financing at a level of a normal home loan 2) cut out the real estate developer profit margin, I wonder if a co-op model would become viable in the US.
Edit to add: Intuitively it seems like the math could work out, if you figure that a co-op takes the appreciation of the real estate out of the picture for the people living there, and that being able to rebalance that lost value towards the initial cost or towards future costs would be a trade-off normal people would be willing to make.
In that sense a co-op is more like an alternative to renting rather than an alternative to home ownership.
pcrh · 1h ago
Note that most people rent, even in the US. They either rent the property itself, or they rent the capital used to buy the property (i.e. a mortgage).
With that in mind, housing associations or co-ops and the like take the place of banks, that is, they possess the capital and rent the property to the residents, but keep a portion of the revenue for future renting, as a bank does for future lending.
The difference between the two is that the housing association is typically not-for-profit, and that in a housing association the resident does not accumulate capital, which allows for a reduction in costs compared to a mortgage.
manwe150 · 1h ago
I don’t have any numbers to counter whether it is typical of “most”, but when trying to buy, I was outbid several times by people who paid “in cash”, and that was for million+ dollar homes. So it might be they do “rent” the capital, but possibly from a source other than a bank (eg from their forgone returns on stocks instead)
pcrh · 1h ago
Sure, some people do have "cash" to buy a property. However, the vast majority of home buyers do not, and many who offer "cash" may have pre-approved loans.
yupitsme123 · 2h ago
I think San Francisco has something like this with their Below Market Rate (BMR) housing program. You have to be below a certain income to be considered, and basically you get to pay a fixed monthly rate to "own" a place that can only be sold for a fixed amount. It always just sounded like rent to me.
I think that NYC's co-ops (TICs in San Francisco) provided an interesting alternative model. They usually require owner-occupancy, can't be rented easily, and are difficult to finance.
These restrictions eliminate investors and speculators, and shields the the units from the inflation that happens from fed intervention and super low rates.
The result is that they're usually priced a lot lower and appreciate more slowly than they would be if they were condos.
marcinzm · 1h ago
There’s a number of these types of co-ops in NYC although these are due to government legislation and I do not know if there are any less than decades old.
mg · 3h ago
his apartment ... two bedrooms, a small office, a
south-facing balcony and it costs 1,760 francs
(about $2,200) a month, around half the typical rents
I always find it impossible to grasp/compare rents if there is no mention of the size of the apartment. For all I know, this could be a 60m² apartment with 3 smallish rooms which goes for something like half of that price in Berlin:
The issue with them is that the loans to build the properties are socialised, so if the other members can not pay the debt, the entire loan is the responsibility of those members who can.
Also, the incentives of a cheaper than market rate flat, means that corruption and nepotism is rampant in those buildings.
It is not pretty in practice.
cnnlives71 · 2h ago
> Also, the incentives of a cheaper than market rate flat, means that corruption and nepotism is rampant in those buildings.
But if it were a flat/apartment, the owner/manager may not actually take good care of the apartment. Which is worse?
ExxKA · 1h ago
You mean if people living there were renting?
This is purely anecdotal, but I find that the buildings with professional management and purely renting tenants, look better and seem more well kept, compared to the smaller "Andelsforeninger" where its a volunteer management team trying to run it.
awongh · 3h ago
> Also, the incentives of a cheaper than market rate flat, means that corruption and nepotism is rampant in those buildings.
Maybe there's some middle ground between socialized housing that incentivizes people to take advantage of overly cheap housing, and a 100% capitalist USA style housing market where lots of people are 1 missed paycheck away from being homeless.
FirmwareBurner · 3h ago
>Maybe there's some middle ground
Maybe there is, but human history proves we can't easily reach a equilibrium where everyone has it equally good, due to human greed, envy, cronyism and corruption, making any kind of equality just a fairytale utopia.
So we just bounce between extremes because as always, few people strive have it good and the rest get screwed over in order to pay for the privileges of the select few. There will always be haves and have-nots, no matter how many thumbs the government puts on the scales to try to balance things out for everyone which only breaks things for the worst as they distort economic reality.
Meanwhile from the numbers I gathered, despite the "evil capitalism", statistically by most metrics, Americans enjoy the highest purchasing power for home ownership in the developed western world by a large margin. So Americans love to complain too much, but the truth is by the numbers, most of the world has it much worse than they do.
1. Demographia International Housing Affordability | Lower median multiple = higher affordability (2025 Edition)
Singapore 4.2
United States 4.8
Ireland 5.1
Canada 5.4
United Kingdom 5.6
New Zealand 7.7
Australia 9.7
2. World Population Review: Housing Affordability Index | Higher index = higher purchasing power (2024 Data)
United States 3.3
Denmark 2.1
Belgium 2.1
Ireland 1.8
Luxembourg 1.8
Norway 1.7
Sweden 1.7
Finland 1.7
Spain 1.7
Netherlands 1.7
Germany 1.5
Switzerland 1.5
3. Numbeo Property Prices Index | Lower ratio = higher affordability (2025 Mid-Year)
United States 3.44
Germany 8.5
United Kingdom 8.71
Italy 9.04
Canada 9.45
France 9.89
Japan 11.34
Refreeze5224 · 2h ago
I firmly disagree that history proves this. The history of certain countries, certain economic systems, and certain systems of social organization have proven inequitable, but most people are unfamiliar with the many systems that have proven workable, but have not provided for a small hierarchical cadre of people with coercive power over others. It's not surprising that this sort of thing is not taught within a capitalist or statist system, but they certainly do exist, and have throughout human history, which is much longer than the last 500 years or so existence of hierarchical states and capitalism.
See David Graeber's The Dawn of Everything for a deep dive into some of the many successful systems of human societal organization.
Refreeze5224 · 2h ago
It is refreshing to see one of the most vital elements to human survival treated as just that, rather than a mere commodity like gold, to be bought and sold with a focus on equity and profit.
This does not and has never made sense, in the same way that only buying food with an eye towards someday making a profit from it does not make sense.
It does make sense within our current economic system, which sadly does not make any distinction between the fundamental requirements of human life, and all other products or commodities. We all are worse off for not being able to see the difference and separate the two.
simne · 1h ago
Well, this so called "third way", as I know appear in US as private elder care infrastructure, or as charity.
When somebody become so weak (ill or old), cannot care for himself and unfortunately have no family, they could ask to local private care to live in their specialized hostel. And it is not always just ordinary hostel with one room for 5 persons, but some are more like classic motels, with rooms for two persons.
Also, similar infrastructure existed for a long time in Italy, under Catholics church, and I know few good young people, who grown there.
As I know in Northern Europe (Sweden), there are many community buildings (under municipalities), very cheap to rent and even possible to get social donations and not pay at all.
Existed also non-church homes with similar economy (and also not designed as charity), but their examples are not always good. For example, Pruitt–Igoe in St. Louis, Missouri, United States, becomes huge crime center. Other not good example, some bad districts in exUSSR (for example Biryulyovo in Moscow, or Orekhovo-Zuyevo in Moscow Oblast, Russia), also known for their criminal level.
From Pruitt–Igoe experience, people created few rules about so called social homes, and one rule, they must be non-comfortable, to motivate people to grow to commercial rentals or even to once buy own home; second, should be some power, who will constantly monitor residents for crime and immediately deport offenders. So they are not "Third way", they are just temporary solution of very old problem, and not easy solution, even not cheap.
It's all fun and games, but you need to remember that this is Canton Vaud, one of the most fiscally irresponsible cantons/states in all of Switzerland. The article briefly mentions is, but a lot of this "cooperative" housing is heavily subsidized by the canton itself (the article mentions the cheaper 99-year lease but it goes way beyond that) and the resulting shortfall in money is paid for by other people (i.e 100,000CHF yearly income in Vaud is the massive marginal tax wall in Vaud). I've still, to this day, not managed to find out any detail about how these apartments are valued for the purpose of the VD wealth taxes (You can impute house price based on comparatives or rent, here obviously rent would be lower).
fxtentacle · 3h ago
This is becoming more popular in Germany, too. In effect, future renters pool their money into a non-profit which will then build affordable housing, to be owned and inhabited by them.
This should be embraced in the US as well. And we need it now, more than ever because of how the price of housing has jumped so much and will only get worse as private equity continues to hoover up housing stock.
whimsicalism · 41m ago
Private equity is not the cause of the housing crisis in the US and all they are doing is amortizing rental demand. Without private equity, the demand would still be there. Shocking how often this needs to be repeated.
sokoloff · 3h ago
This (and other interventions) will help to the extent that they cause more housing to be built.
If they will more than another change, it will durably improve housing costs. If it doesn’t make more housing, but only changes how it’s bought and financed, it’s probably just noise and distraction.
post- · 3h ago
We could also rein in private equity? Culture Study had a great episode about PE [0] recently, with some explanation of what started it and, if I remember right, some gestures towards how it might be brought to heel — or at least made less bombastically awful for most people.
Private equity has lots of benefits that are never discussed because they make good bogeyman. Existing management is not always good, and I do not benefit from companies employing unnecessary workers and passing the price through to me.
jeffbee · 1h ago
PE has nothing to do with any of it. They are totally up-front, even in their prospectuses, that the only reason they are in this game is because witless dupes (paraphrasing) in local governments are too stupid to build houses. If we would build anything, they wouldn't be in the game.
ori_b · 3h ago
Oh. Company towns.
renewiltord · 2h ago
> Guy who has only seen The Boss Baby, watching his second movie: Getting a lot of 'Boss Baby' vibes from this...
I’ve found in my work with clients is that generally multi ownership in real estate means significantly lower investment returns.
Generally selling a single piece of real estate that you entirely control has the highest investment returns. Things like condos are always competing with each other and coops can be even worse.
Maybe it’s more affordable because it has super low investment returns.
pcrh · 1h ago
That's precisely the point, to be honest.
Treating homes as investments rather than places to live is a significant contributor to their lack of affordability, as it creates two demands for the same property.
This phenomenon is not "necessary", but appears to be particularly common in the US, UK and other Anglophone countries, see this chart: https://i.imgur.com/h1CkkNE.png
I feel like the problem in the US isn't necessarily that the government won't directly pay for these kinds of things like they do in Switzerland, but that it's very very hard to finance a co-op, possibly illegal (that is, you wouldn't have the same legal protections a condo does).
I would be curious to see the finances of the buildings they mention in the article. Assuming that you could arrange the two major financial aspects: 1) financing at a level of a normal home loan 2) cut out the real estate developer profit margin, I wonder if a co-op model would become viable in the US.
Edit to add: Intuitively it seems like the math could work out, if you figure that a co-op takes the appreciation of the real estate out of the picture for the people living there, and that being able to rebalance that lost value towards the initial cost or towards future costs would be a trade-off normal people would be willing to make.
In that sense a co-op is more like an alternative to renting rather than an alternative to home ownership.
With that in mind, housing associations or co-ops and the like take the place of banks, that is, they possess the capital and rent the property to the residents, but keep a portion of the revenue for future renting, as a bank does for future lending.
The difference between the two is that the housing association is typically not-for-profit, and that in a housing association the resident does not accumulate capital, which allows for a reduction in costs compared to a mortgage.
I think that NYC's co-ops (TICs in San Francisco) provided an interesting alternative model. They usually require owner-occupancy, can't be rented easily, and are difficult to finance.
These restrictions eliminate investors and speculators, and shields the the units from the inflation that happens from fed intervention and super low rates.
The result is that they're usually priced a lot lower and appreciate more slowly than they would be if they were condos.
https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/161188147
Or it could be a luxurious 300m² apartment with 3 big rooms that goes for three time that price:
https://www.immobilienscout24.de/expose/157476995
> Claude Waelti’s 1,180-square-foot apartment in Lausanne costs around $2,200 a month. The rent has barely increased since he arrived in 1991.
So about 110 square meters which is pretty good for number of rooms in Switzerland.
No comments yet
https://da.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andelsboligforening
The issue with them is that the loans to build the properties are socialised, so if the other members can not pay the debt, the entire loan is the responsibility of those members who can.
Also, the incentives of a cheaper than market rate flat, means that corruption and nepotism is rampant in those buildings.
It is not pretty in practice.
But if it were a flat/apartment, the owner/manager may not actually take good care of the apartment. Which is worse?
This is purely anecdotal, but I find that the buildings with professional management and purely renting tenants, look better and seem more well kept, compared to the smaller "Andelsforeninger" where its a volunteer management team trying to run it.
Maybe there's some middle ground between socialized housing that incentivizes people to take advantage of overly cheap housing, and a 100% capitalist USA style housing market where lots of people are 1 missed paycheck away from being homeless.
Maybe there is, but human history proves we can't easily reach a equilibrium where everyone has it equally good, due to human greed, envy, cronyism and corruption, making any kind of equality just a fairytale utopia.
So we just bounce between extremes because as always, few people strive have it good and the rest get screwed over in order to pay for the privileges of the select few. There will always be haves and have-nots, no matter how many thumbs the government puts on the scales to try to balance things out for everyone which only breaks things for the worst as they distort economic reality.
Meanwhile from the numbers I gathered, despite the "evil capitalism", statistically by most metrics, Americans enjoy the highest purchasing power for home ownership in the developed western world by a large margin. So Americans love to complain too much, but the truth is by the numbers, most of the world has it much worse than they do.
See David Graeber's The Dawn of Everything for a deep dive into some of the many successful systems of human societal organization.
This does not and has never made sense, in the same way that only buying food with an eye towards someday making a profit from it does not make sense.
It does make sense within our current economic system, which sadly does not make any distinction between the fundamental requirements of human life, and all other products or commodities. We all are worse off for not being able to see the difference and separate the two.
When somebody become so weak (ill or old), cannot care for himself and unfortunately have no family, they could ask to local private care to live in their specialized hostel. And it is not always just ordinary hostel with one room for 5 persons, but some are more like classic motels, with rooms for two persons.
Also, similar infrastructure existed for a long time in Italy, under Catholics church, and I know few good young people, who grown there.
As I know in Northern Europe (Sweden), there are many community buildings (under municipalities), very cheap to rent and even possible to get social donations and not pay at all.
Existed also non-church homes with similar economy (and also not designed as charity), but their examples are not always good. For example, Pruitt–Igoe in St. Louis, Missouri, United States, becomes huge crime center. Other not good example, some bad districts in exUSSR (for example Biryulyovo in Moscow, or Orekhovo-Zuyevo in Moscow Oblast, Russia), also known for their criminal level.
From Pruitt–Igoe experience, people created few rules about so called social homes, and one rule, they must be non-comfortable, to motivate people to grow to commercial rentals or even to once buy own home; second, should be some power, who will constantly monitor residents for crime and immediately deport offenders. So they are not "Third way", they are just temporary solution of very old problem, and not easy solution, even not cheap.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pruitt%E2%80%93Igoe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_cooperative
If they will more than another change, it will durably improve housing costs. If it doesn’t make more housing, but only changes how it’s bought and financed, it’s probably just noise and distraction.
[0]: https://culturestudypod.substack.com/p/how-private-equity-de...
https://x.com/afraidofwasps/status/1177301482464526337?lang=...
Generally selling a single piece of real estate that you entirely control has the highest investment returns. Things like condos are always competing with each other and coops can be even worse.
Maybe it’s more affordable because it has super low investment returns.
Treating homes as investments rather than places to live is a significant contributor to their lack of affordability, as it creates two demands for the same property.
This phenomenon is not "necessary", but appears to be particularly common in the US, UK and other Anglophone countries, see this chart: https://i.imgur.com/h1CkkNE.png