Kansas City, MO recently did the same thing[0], accompanied by the indictment of a tow operator in two different counties for falsifying state forms to make it appear as if the vehicles they had wrongfully towed had been towed according to the law, then abandoned by the owners, allowing for the operator to claim them.[1]
While these are nice developments, arguably, it's worse than bank robbery; in much of the country (Kansas City in particular), if you're without a car, you're screwed. No doctor appointments, no school, no grocery shopping, no social life, no job. Treat it as such. If you take someone's car without permission, you should face a significant fraction of a decade in prison, per vehicle.
Towing cars is the modern equivalent of taking horses and boots.
themanmaran · 12h ago
Got curious about the "century old statute" and looked it up. Original text [1]
> Section 1. Whenever any motor-vehicle is found abandoned upon any public highway… and said vehicle is not of a value exceeding one hundred dollars… said officer may cause such motor-vehicle to be removed
> Section 2. If such motor-vehicle is not reclaimed within fifteen days after such removal, said officer shall sell the same at public auction…
Do they adjust for inflation? I have a hard time getting a tire for $100 now, never mind a whole car.
themanmaran · 11h ago
Apparently the new number is $1500. But it's at the tow driver's discretion so they can estimate the value at $1,499.
doctorwho42 · 10h ago
For reference, I have a used car from 1998. Kind of a junker, but has a fun v6 in it (manual). But the point is, my city values it at $1500 and hasn't let that value go any lower for city vehicle tax purposes.
So I'd imagine most cars ever if old junk piles are still worth $1500 to the state.
No comments yet
kulahan · 11h ago
I’m not sure this makes a huge difference if the goal is to get obvious pieces of junk off the highway? Does a $1600 car really matter that much more than even a $1500 car?
jjk166 · 10h ago
I think the point is that somebody can look at a brand new mint condition bugatti and say "that looks like it's worth less than $1500 to me" and then take it. It's not good to rely on people to be honest when it is in their financial best interest not to be.
noleary · 12h ago
Related context: How a Connecticut DMV Employee Made Thousands by Selling Towed Cars
"Connecticut’s law allows tow companies to begin the process to sell vehicles after just 15 days."
New law updates it to 30 days, except for vehicles worth under $1500 which is still 15 days, which may be an interesting opportunity to see how towers do time value of money decisions on so many $1499 cars.
Gibbon1 · 12h ago
The law should just require the cops move the offending car to a different location and issue a fine. There shouldn't any private towing and impound at all.
JumpCrisscross · 11h ago
> law should just require the cops move the offending car to a different location and issue a fine
Who pays for all that parking? Security? Customer service?
jjk166 · 10h ago
Presumably the fine should cover it. The customer service costs are pretty constant regardless of impound duration, and you locate the impound in a place where a big empty lot with a fence is not expensive. If space needs to be made, the decision of when a car can be removed should be made by someone with no financial stake in the outcome.
kotaKat · 7h ago
Whatever happened to the trope that your car got towed to "the police impound"? Tow it back to the police station lot.
JumpCrisscross · 6h ago
> Tow it back to the police station lot
What does this solve?
As someone who isn’t constantly getting his car towed, I’d insist this be done at least revenue neutrally. And civil asset forfeiture is way harder to fight than wrongful sale off a private lot.
kelnos · 10h ago
Usually the people who want their cars back end up paying it.
trollbridge · 10h ago
There is vast amounts of free parking in America. A small amount extra for storing towed vehicles doesn't seem like that big of a deal.
healsdata · 10h ago
> After weeks of negotiations, lawmakers said they came to a compromise with the towing industry.
Maybe just phrasing, but I hate the idea that we have to compromise our laws with private companies that only have to maximize shareholder value. If a law that treats the public fairly also puts tow companies out of business, so be it.
p_ing · 7h ago
Do you seriously think a towing company is a publicly traded company?
FuriouslyAdrift · 10h ago
Nothing compared to the old Chicago Lincoln Park Pirates...
>[It] does all of this without undercutting the essential work that ethical and professional tow operators do each and every day for us
Very clever words directed at tow operators here. If you aren't doing anything unethical, you should have no objections, right?
gambiting · 10h ago
How come towing vehicles is so common in the US, but not so much in the UK? I've literally never heard of anyone getting their vehicle towed away over here, but it sounds like in US you can get it towed for something as minor as not paying for parking(which just results in getting a fine here).
Genuienly curious.
naijaboiler · 7h ago
Many American states have laws that allow tow companies to rob people.
Tow companies literally just go into parking lot of apartment complexes they have a contract with and start removing cars with expired or non visible parking stickers. Nobody called them, the car is not a problem. They then only take cash, are not available on weekends, charge you some crazy rate like 150/day, won’t even let you into the car to get your personal items, then after 15 days, they sell your car. It’s functionally just stealing from the poor
They particularly like doing it on days with bad weather too. And they are so rude and aggressive and antagonistic. I’m convinced any time a tow company is short on cash, they just send their people out there to hunt for cars to tow
And since it’s mostly poor minorities that bear the brunt of these abuses, many people are okay with it
SoftTalker · 3h ago
In the US if you park on the street and don't pay, or overstay the time you paid for, you're generally only going to get a ticket/fine. You might get towed if you're blocking a fire hydrant or parked in a fire lane or blocking a bus stop or traffic lane or something like that.
You have to be very careful on private property particularly apartment residences, many have contracts with towing companies to remove unauthorized vehicles. You need to be sure you're in a designated "guest parking" area or that there is no issue with parking in an available space. Same for retail and restaurants especially those that are close to some other attraction. They want the parking for their customers and if they figure out that you've parked there and walked away they will have your car towed. They are supposed to post signs if there is a tow policy but they aren't always very visible so you have to look around or talk to the property manager.
Probably $100-$200 to get it back, usually cash only. I'd like to see an audit of their books. Depending on the state or local laws they might not be able to actually keep your car if you just demand it back. It's your property and they have no claim on it. They would need to get a court order to force you to pay. They will not tell you this and will act quite agressive if you challenge them, but if you know your rights you might be able to say "well I'll call the sheriff and we'll see what they say about it."
imglorp · 10h ago
It's common for people to ignore parking fines until they pile up. A city might "boot" the car to disable it, or they can tow it; either way extorting the owner to pay. Also, private parking areas contract with tow companies which incentivizes the tow companies to patrol proactively looking for violators and tow anyone without a permit or whatever. So a market was created.
masfuerte · 10h ago
Moderately recently (maybe ten years ago?) the police got the power to seize and destroy abandoned vehicles. This was intended to address the occasional obvious wreck you see at the roadside. Flat tyres, broken windows, full of rubbish, etc.
But there have been a few cases of people going on holiday for a fortnight and returning to find that their old but taxed and insured car has been taken. And they have no legal redress!
This does seem to be very rare though.
gambiting · 8h ago
Is that in the UK or US? Sorry just isn't clear from the post.
masfuerte · 8h ago
Sorry, England.
tzs · 8h ago
How do you handle it in the UK if you arrive home and find that someone has parked in your private driveway without permission which prevents you from parking your car on your property?
gambiting · 8h ago
I don't know, I've never heard of that happening to anyone.
But a quick google says if that were to happen to you it's best to just leave it and wait for the owner to come back, it's not illegal(it's only a civil offence so you'd need to sue the person who did it), if you get it towed you have to pay for the tow and you'd be responsible for any damages that happen to the car in that time.
Again, that sounds purely theoretical, I can't imagine it's actually common.
Is that a common issue in the US?
tzs · 5h ago
I've seen it fairly often at apartments in the US that have assigned parking spaces.
While these are nice developments, arguably, it's worse than bank robbery; in much of the country (Kansas City in particular), if you're without a car, you're screwed. No doctor appointments, no school, no grocery shopping, no social life, no job. Treat it as such. If you take someone's car without permission, you should face a significant fraction of a decade in prison, per vehicle.
[0] https://www.kmbc.com/article/kansas-city-ordinance-cracks-do...
[1] https://www.kmbc.com/article/kansas-city-towing-company-unau...
> Section 1. Whenever any motor-vehicle is found abandoned upon any public highway… and said vehicle is not of a value exceeding one hundred dollars… said officer may cause such motor-vehicle to be removed
> Section 2. If such motor-vehicle is not reclaimed within fifteen days after such removal, said officer shall sell the same at public auction…
[1] https://books.google.com/books?id=gktNAQAAMAAJ&hl=en
So I'd imagine most cars ever if old junk piles are still worth $1500 to the state.
No comments yet
https://www.propublica.org/article/connecticut-dmv-employee-...
New law updates it to 30 days, except for vehicles worth under $1500 which is still 15 days, which may be an interesting opportunity to see how towers do time value of money decisions on so many $1499 cars.
Who pays for all that parking? Security? Customer service?
What does this solve?
As someone who isn’t constantly getting his car towed, I’d insist this be done at least revenue neutrally. And civil asset forfeiture is way harder to fight than wrongful sale off a private lot.
Maybe just phrasing, but I hate the idea that we have to compromise our laws with private companies that only have to maximize shareholder value. If a law that treats the public fairly also puts tow companies out of business, so be it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincoln_Towing_Service
Very clever words directed at tow operators here. If you aren't doing anything unethical, you should have no objections, right?
Genuienly curious.
Tow companies literally just go into parking lot of apartment complexes they have a contract with and start removing cars with expired or non visible parking stickers. Nobody called them, the car is not a problem. They then only take cash, are not available on weekends, charge you some crazy rate like 150/day, won’t even let you into the car to get your personal items, then after 15 days, they sell your car. It’s functionally just stealing from the poor
They particularly like doing it on days with bad weather too. And they are so rude and aggressive and antagonistic. I’m convinced any time a tow company is short on cash, they just send their people out there to hunt for cars to tow
And since it’s mostly poor minorities that bear the brunt of these abuses, many people are okay with it
You have to be very careful on private property particularly apartment residences, many have contracts with towing companies to remove unauthorized vehicles. You need to be sure you're in a designated "guest parking" area or that there is no issue with parking in an available space. Same for retail and restaurants especially those that are close to some other attraction. They want the parking for their customers and if they figure out that you've parked there and walked away they will have your car towed. They are supposed to post signs if there is a tow policy but they aren't always very visible so you have to look around or talk to the property manager.
Probably $100-$200 to get it back, usually cash only. I'd like to see an audit of their books. Depending on the state or local laws they might not be able to actually keep your car if you just demand it back. It's your property and they have no claim on it. They would need to get a court order to force you to pay. They will not tell you this and will act quite agressive if you challenge them, but if you know your rights you might be able to say "well I'll call the sheriff and we'll see what they say about it."
But there have been a few cases of people going on holiday for a fortnight and returning to find that their old but taxed and insured car has been taken. And they have no legal redress!
This does seem to be very rare though.
But a quick google says if that were to happen to you it's best to just leave it and wait for the owner to come back, it's not illegal(it's only a civil offence so you'd need to sue the person who did it), if you get it towed you have to pay for the tow and you'd be responsible for any damages that happen to the car in that time.
Again, that sounds purely theoretical, I can't imagine it's actually common.
Is that a common issue in the US?