Item #388293 of things that would never happen in America.
During the Cold War, even the Soviet Union had better missile defense and civil defense infrastructure than the US.
0xWTF · 1h ago
In case you haven't contemplated this logistics challenge before: the key is you need to stock shelf-stable products in these stores and at some point in their shelf life, transfer them out to other stores for actual consumption and back fill the emergency stores with fresh lots of new shelf stable products. You're just buying more shelf-stable supply once and then managing the transit through the supply chain with speed bump before the last mile.
tshaddox · 35m ago
Is that so? I presumed they would always be open as normal stores, but prepared to stay open as “emergency stores” when necessary.
paranoidrobot · 30m ago
They are normal stores.
The OP is talking about how they handle keeping fresh stock of products with lower sales volume. (Or at least, that's the way I'm reading it)
pogue · 3m ago
It's a very good idea. I wish we had good ideas in the United States.
patrickhogan1 · 14m ago
Good idea. Smart that they can withstand 72-hour power issues. 3 days still seems short, but much better than current.
I'm with the mormons on this issue, who emphasize preparedness for emergencies. Typically storing up to a year of non-perishable food.
ambicapter · 2h ago
Wait, so we're now approaching risk levels high enough that's its economically feasible for businesses to prepare for situations where their stores lose power, telecom, and resupply? Are we already preparing for land war across western Europe?
TazeTSchnitzel · 1h ago
I don't think Denmark in particular is preparing, because at the end of the year their national postal service will cease to deliver letters (after the government removed the legal requirement for it to do so), and more than 85% of Danes will only be able to receive government and commercial letters in digital form via a privately owned cloud service (e-Boks). That is an alarming level of concentration. If I were hypothetically in control of a state that was planning to go to war with Denmark and had the resources for hybrid warfare, I know which company's servers I'd want to take down first.
TowerTall · 8m ago
Denmark are. Only two days ago the danish PM on public TV said the had ordered the head of the danish military to "buy, buy, buy" [1][2] [as many weapons as the can get their hands on]. This is repeatition of of what she said 6 months ago[3]
I sure am! And as a strategical prepper, I've left the entire continent behind well before shit hits the fan.
Hopefully I'll have my new life sufficiently set up to help those I love and left behind, and even more hopefully they'll be able to get out, once the shit actually hits.
I'd like for them to come to me earlier, but I don't think I'll get more than visits until bombs start falling. If I'm lucky some of them will already be here visiting me when that happens. Then they can just stay. The rest will at least know they have a safe haven if they can just manage to get here.
Izikiel43 · 52m ago
Asia, Australia or south America?
maxerickson · 46m ago
3 days isn't very long, it's reasonable to look at this as a generic resiliency thing rather than response to some identifiable risk.
lovich · 30m ago
It’s also reasonable to look at it as a “the populace goes nuts every time there’s some minor shock to the logistics chain, so might as well prepare for that reaction”
maxbond · 1h ago
Everyone should give that some thought but look at Texas. In 2021 they were devastated by a snowstorm. This year they were devastated by flooding. Not to pick on Texas, they aren't the only ones caught under prepared for severe weather. Wildfires and drought in the western states is another thing we're under prepared for. And look at the hoarding of toilet paper etc. in 2020. I presume there's been problems in Europe that I'm not aware of that are more relevant to Denmark's calculus.
The climate is changing. Natural disasters are going to be more common. It's prudent to prepare for it.
TazeTSchnitzel · 1h ago
Just this last week, all the major cargo train lines in northern Sweden suffered big derailments simultaneously, and several dozen roads were made unusable. This was all from a single incident of unusually heavy rain. The country will have badly damaged logistics on the North-South axis for weeks to come, maybe months. https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/vasternorrland/stora-probl...
Preparedness is vital!
heartbreak · 1h ago
Texas also has a grocery store chain that is particularly well-prepared for disasters.
Yup, sometimes people joke that H-E-B is the 4th branch of the Texas government given how much they do during disasters. When food was going to go bad and payment terminals were having issues during the big 2021 winter power outage, pictures of them just giving out cartfuls of groceries were circulating on social media.
kQq9oHeAz6wLLS · 16m ago
The Fat Electrician did a great video on them on his second channel
we may or may not but I don't think this is reflective of it. This is just the fragility of digital societies were one hack or outage can kill entire national payment systems. A few decades ago any store could run three days without power or telecoms.
Here in Germany foreigners often scoff about how prevalent cash is, but to this day nobody has yet invented a payment technology that works without electricity, without transaction costs, and without a third party. As far as I'm concerned cash is still the most futuristic technology we ever invented
anonym29 · 12m ago
Precious metals fill all of your requirements. They do have other challenges, some shared with FIAT, some unique, but we've had the "technology" to solve this problem for thousands of years.
quantummagic · 2h ago
The economic collapse of the west. The great reset is coming...
maxerickson · 45m ago
How is 72 hours of rice going to matter?
catlikesshrimp · 39m ago
That depends. How many people from the list are we leaving in for dinner?
neets · 1h ago
If this is the sentiment on the Silicon Valley Bulletin Board that is Hacker News it may be time to take this stuff seriously
mh- · 52m ago
> Silicon Valley Bulletin Board
The participating commenter base on this site has been much wider than could be described that way for many years.
lovich · 26m ago
At least a decade. I’ve never been there and joined early in my career when I was told by mentors that it was a good source of up to date news on technology and the industry
kQq9oHeAz6wLLS · 12m ago
I think the implication with that phrasing is that HN is more left-leaning (like Silicon Valley), which traditionally isn't into "prepping", so this "pro-prepping" article is an interesting anomaly, perhaps even a harbinger.
malfist · 1h ago
Silicon valley is hardly an oracle of all things to come
It’s tougher to quantify and building a connected community than just profiting off users, though.
ksec · 3h ago
>The idea is that no one should be more than 50 km from such a store and it should prevent hoarding/panic buying as people will know basic food will be available in an emergency.
I dont think that is how it works? That is assuming people wont flock out to buy everything in the emergency store. And do people visit it every day or are these "Emergency Stores". After all they need to replenish stock.
Or are these simply some form of marketing play?
Off-Topic: Its been while since I last visited a The Mastodon site and it seems a lot faster than before.
pySSK · 2h ago
Quotas. My Trader Joe's had a limit of one roll of toilet paper during the pandemic breadlines.
rtpg · 2h ago
Yeah my impression is shortages are generated by everyone buying _just a bit more_ at once given how so much is just-in-time-y
eru · 2h ago
> That is assuming people wont flock out to buy everything in the emergency store.
Well, you could make everything really expensive in these emergency stores during an emergency.
chrisphilip · 2h ago
Isn’t this just price gouging which is illegal in much of the US at least, I don’t know about internationally.
dcow · 36m ago
I think there’s a subtle difference between charging everyone $100 per umbrella in a rain storm vs charging $100 for your last few umbrellas. Former is price gouging; latter is just economics.
14 · 2h ago
We all saw what happened with Covid and panic buying. I remember when initial reports about it started coming out and something about it told me this might actually become something serious. So I went and loaded up on flour and yeast, rice, cooking oil, lots of non perishable items and a bunch of meat in a huge costco run before it took off. I had enough to last me a good year if my family had to ration. Then it spread like fire and people went crazy. I remember being at costco for a couple things I didn't think to stock pile (toilet paper) and there was virtually no meat left on the shelf. They had to queue the door as so many people were there to panic buy.
So if an event happened that even slightly appeared to suggest things might get tough for a while people will always panic buy. Without limits those with money will buy it up.
I did the same thing like a couple years after initial Covid when we had massive flooding in Abbotsford. I heard on the news something like an estimated 100,000 chickens were killed in the flood. I stood up, grabbed my keys and got into my car. I went and bought like a few hundred dollars in chicken. 2 days later facebook was full of posts about how all the chicken is gone and none on the shelves. Luckily it didn't last long and I believe they managed to get a bunch from Washington state but it was all at an increased cost.
I am not rich but I am thankful that I am in enough of a position that I can load up if I feel there might be a need to. A few people said I was part of the problem buying lots like that buy I always did it preemptively before the surge started. And in my defense when you literally could not buy toilet paper, I kept a bunch in my car. I work as a health care working visiting people at home. I gave out dozens of rolls so elderly could have it meaning I would at times run out. I also have helped out countless clients with no food out of my own pocket. But I am the provider for my family so I need to ensure they are okay.
glxxyz · 50m ago
This reads like "Confessions of a Panic Buyer".
jpalawaga · 2h ago
Buying a bunch and then blaming everyone else 12h after you seems disingenuous.
It sounds like you’re trying to clear your conscious from panic buying. However, some people went to the store to find nothing because they weren’t able to go at the same time as you.
red369 · 1h ago
I tend to agree.
I didn't rush off to panic buy, but when I first heard about it happening, I did go to do a normal grocery run in case things later ran out. There was nothing on my list. Also, there was almost nothing on the shelves. It was like the supermarket had been looted. Well, of everything edible or useful anyway. Probably high-value, non-essentials were still there, unlike in real looting.
I walked and walked the aisles, and the only thing I could find that we might eat were black olives. I disliked black olives (as apparently did everyone else), but I bought (and later ate) them anyway. That wasn't the only thing edible in the supermarket - it was a while ago, so I forget what was still there. Perhaps condiments, and obscure baking ingredients.
I held out from panic buying right through, but once the shelves were restocked I started buying a couple extra of everything each time, as long as there were lots on the shelf. I gradually filled one cupboard shelf with 6-7 of every canned and jarred food we eat. Later on, there were a few more instances of people panic buying at the slightest provocation (1), and I now assume people will do it if allowed.
I am not blaming others at all but my point was more to ops question about people panic buying the answer is yes people will do so. Without limits those with lots of money will take the lions share.
I am not trying to clear my conscious. I know I am a good person and literally would give the shirt off my back. But I had a hint things might get bad and as a father of young children above all and everything in this world I had to make sure I had at least a bit or reserves if things got bad. I am not rich at all so when I say I did a costco run I am not talking like thousands of dollars. More like an $800 run which is nothing, but I know how to make that much last a long time. I got a bunch of flour and rice. Some meats and tomato sauce. I would not be eating in luxury had their been a long term shortage but I would at least be able to make some bread and basic foods to keep my family feed even if poorly.
No comments yet
Larrikin · 1h ago
It was gone because of people like you.
londons_explore · 1h ago
What pays for this?
If an emergency store costs 10% more to run, and emergencies are only 1 day in 10,000, then prices during emergencies would need to be 1000x normal for it to make business sense.
Unfortunately anti-price-gouging laws wouldn't allow that, nor would you manage to keep law and order in the shop when telling customers that a bottle of water is gonna cost them 2000 dollars/euros.
glxxyz · 1h ago
It sounds like the company is doing it as a community service. It doesn't make 'business sense' except perhaps by improving the company's image. Companies also donate to charities etc.
“This is our core task and a responsibility we take on, and we also believe that it is timely […] that we – like other countries – prepare for possible crisis situations, which a good and constructive dialogue with the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness has also confirmed. We hope that this will not be necessary, but should it happen, our customers can count on us.”
It's important to note that the Salling Group is privately owned with only a few owners [1]. It's easier for such companies to do such things than a publicly owned one.
Public companies do this sort of thing too, or at least they used to. It's typically grouped under 'Corporate Social Responsibility'. They aren't doing it out of pure altruism:
From https://benevity.com/resources/corporate-social-responsibili...
"CSR increases customer retention and loyalty: Research shows that 87% of Americans are more likely to buy a product from a company that they can align their values with, and over half of all consumers are willing to pay extra for a product if they’re buying from a company with a sturdy CSR strategy."
tokai · 3h ago
Feels a bit like cheeky marketing from Salling Group, when its just a concept years away from being rolled out. I don't see them running stores with sub optimal stock and other complexities, just for the good of their hearts. Or maybe they just looked at the odds and concluded that likelihood of a lockdown-like event is enough to make it a sound investment.
nmstoker · 2h ago
Without power they could use backup sources but without telecoms isn't payment going to be difficult to impossible? (except those who had sufficient cash before the emergency)
extraduder_ire · 2h ago
You can do offline verification of payment cards, there's just higher fees and lower limits on payments.
This is a common way people get their current accounts into debt without authorising an overdraught.
macintux · 19m ago
When I was a kid, I remember the cashier at a department store checking a book for my mother’s credit card number.
I misunderstood the nature of the book, assuming it was a list of valid card numbers. It was, of course, the opposite, so when I said to my mom “I hope they find your number in there” she replied “I hope they don’t!”
Maxious · 11m ago
EMV cards can do offline auth
14 · 1h ago
Well I assume if they set it up in mind that they would be operating in an emergency they could have something like Starlink and connect to payment processors.
3eb7988a1663 · 2h ago
Does this just mean bags of rice/beans? 10kg of rice will store quite a while and provide many days of food.
unethical_ban · 4h ago
Three days seems low, but any resilience is better than no resilience.
arlort · 9m ago
They're realistically not preparing for a zombie apocalypse
If power goes out really bad, there's some kind of major weather event in some part of the country etc 3 days is a reasonable time frame for emergency measures to be put in place
eddythompson80 · 3h ago
Well, there is always the question of who’s gonna pay for that resiliency. We see it all the time in software deployment. After each extended outage of a major network or cloud/service provider, there is always a flurry of sudden interest in disaster recovery, multi-zonal deployments, failover solutions, and redundancy up and down the chain of everything. 6 months or a year later, people and organizations get sick of paying for that. They either nerf it, making it just a useless checkbox or just abandon it completely because “if us-east-2 is down, then everything is down. Who cares”. A couple of years pass, then another incident happens, rinse and repeat.
hadlock · 3h ago
A big chunk of society has realistically 2-3 days of groceries in their house, plus maybe a 5-year-old bag of rice or pasta and can of string beans buried way in the back. If you have a 1-6 year old you're probably buying 1-3 gallons of milk per week, and need to get more tomorrow.
bigiain · 2h ago
As much as I detest organised religion, the Mormons have a pretty good take on this. They strive to have a six month supply of food/water/cash on hand at all times.
throwaway31131 · 1h ago
I get it. But on the other hand, if you in a situation that requires a six month food supply, because there is no resupply available and you can’t relocate, you have bigger problems. Like the mob of hungry people outside your house.
glxxyz · 1h ago
I think about that too. My home is isolated with plenty of firewood, well water, solar power and a backup whole house generator with weeks/months of propane. I'm unlikely to last more than a few days into the apocalypse without it all being taken from me by someone stronger or better armed.
toast0 · 1h ago
If you have a six month food supply, and survivable disasters really only need a week or two tops, you will have no reservations helping out your neighbors, which helps you be a positive influence on your community in time of need.
If you've only got two days supply, you may not be so generous.
abdullahkhalids · 1h ago
This is why it's important to build a diet with grains and beans. They are cheap and last for months/years at home if stored properly. So you can easily have enough stored at home to eat for at least a few weeks.
downrightmike · 3h ago
After covid, we keep a stock of extra dry goods on hand. If you need that much milk, it can just be frozen when found on sale. As long as it completely defrosts, you don't get any ice
larholm · 4h ago
These stores are not supposed to prepare you for three days of resilience in advance.
They are meant to be available as reliable and functioning stores throughout a crisis period. Your go-to destination for purchasing vital goods during the crisis.
fragmede · 3h ago
It's the local supermarket. How many days in advance am I supposed to have food for? (I have prepper quantities of food and don't know what's normal. three days seems pretty normal to me.)
mopsi · 3h ago
Three days is realistic timeframe for restoring power and rudimentary network connectivity.
During the Cold War, even the Soviet Union had better missile defense and civil defense infrastructure than the US.
The OP is talking about how they handle keeping fresh stock of products with lower sales volume. (Or at least, that's the way I'm reading it)
I'm with the mormons on this issue, who emphasize preparedness for emergencies. Typically storing up to a year of non-perishable food.
[1] https://www.dr.dk/drn-video/67b5f9f966d82a0507aeda6a
[2] https://www.berlingske.dk/politik/mette-frederiksen-vil-slaa...
[3] https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/denmark-boost-2025-26-d...
Hopefully I'll have my new life sufficiently set up to help those I love and left behind, and even more hopefully they'll be able to get out, once the shit actually hits.
I'd like for them to come to me earlier, but I don't think I'll get more than visits until bombs start falling. If I'm lucky some of them will already be here visiting me when that happens. Then they can just stay. The rest will at least know they have a safe haven if they can just manage to get here.
The climate is changing. Natural disasters are going to be more common. It's prudent to prepare for it.
Preparedness is vital!
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/22/us/texas-heb-winter-storm...
https://youtu.be/23sehACMR6s
Here in Germany foreigners often scoff about how prevalent cash is, but to this day nobody has yet invented a payment technology that works without electricity, without transaction costs, and without a third party. As far as I'm concerned cash is still the most futuristic technology we ever invented
The participating commenter base on this site has been much wider than could be described that way for many years.
- 2018, https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/feb/15/why-silicon-val...
- 2022, https://www.theguardian.com/news/2022/sep/04/super-rich-prep...
It’s tougher to quantify and building a connected community than just profiting off users, though.
I dont think that is how it works? That is assuming people wont flock out to buy everything in the emergency store. And do people visit it every day or are these "Emergency Stores". After all they need to replenish stock.
Or are these simply some form of marketing play?
Off-Topic: Its been while since I last visited a The Mastodon site and it seems a lot faster than before.
Well, you could make everything really expensive in these emergency stores during an emergency.
So if an event happened that even slightly appeared to suggest things might get tough for a while people will always panic buy. Without limits those with money will buy it up.
I did the same thing like a couple years after initial Covid when we had massive flooding in Abbotsford. I heard on the news something like an estimated 100,000 chickens were killed in the flood. I stood up, grabbed my keys and got into my car. I went and bought like a few hundred dollars in chicken. 2 days later facebook was full of posts about how all the chicken is gone and none on the shelves. Luckily it didn't last long and I believe they managed to get a bunch from Washington state but it was all at an increased cost.
I am not rich but I am thankful that I am in enough of a position that I can load up if I feel there might be a need to. A few people said I was part of the problem buying lots like that buy I always did it preemptively before the surge started. And in my defense when you literally could not buy toilet paper, I kept a bunch in my car. I work as a health care working visiting people at home. I gave out dozens of rolls so elderly could have it meaning I would at times run out. I also have helped out countless clients with no food out of my own pocket. But I am the provider for my family so I need to ensure they are okay.
It sounds like you’re trying to clear your conscious from panic buying. However, some people went to the store to find nothing because they weren’t able to go at the same time as you.
I didn't rush off to panic buy, but when I first heard about it happening, I did go to do a normal grocery run in case things later ran out. There was nothing on my list. Also, there was almost nothing on the shelves. It was like the supermarket had been looted. Well, of everything edible or useful anyway. Probably high-value, non-essentials were still there, unlike in real looting.
I walked and walked the aisles, and the only thing I could find that we might eat were black olives. I disliked black olives (as apparently did everyone else), but I bought (and later ate) them anyway. That wasn't the only thing edible in the supermarket - it was a while ago, so I forget what was still there. Perhaps condiments, and obscure baking ingredients.
I held out from panic buying right through, but once the shelves were restocked I started buying a couple extra of everything each time, as long as there were lots on the shelf. I gradually filled one cupboard shelf with 6-7 of every canned and jarred food we eat. Later on, there were a few more instances of people panic buying at the slightest provocation (1), and I now assume people will do it if allowed.
1) https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/473591/you-don-t-need-to...
I am not trying to clear my conscious. I know I am a good person and literally would give the shirt off my back. But I had a hint things might get bad and as a father of young children above all and everything in this world I had to make sure I had at least a bit or reserves if things got bad. I am not rich at all so when I say I did a costco run I am not talking like thousands of dollars. More like an $800 run which is nothing, but I know how to make that much last a long time. I got a bunch of flour and rice. Some meats and tomato sauce. I would not be eating in luxury had their been a long term shortage but I would at least be able to make some bread and basic foods to keep my family feed even if poorly.
No comments yet
If an emergency store costs 10% more to run, and emergencies are only 1 day in 10,000, then prices during emergencies would need to be 1000x normal for it to make business sense.
Unfortunately anti-price-gouging laws wouldn't allow that, nor would you manage to keep law and order in the shop when telling customers that a bottle of water is gonna cost them 2000 dollars/euros.
“This is our core task and a responsibility we take on, and we also believe that it is timely […] that we – like other countries – prepare for possible crisis situations, which a good and constructive dialogue with the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness has also confirmed. We hope that this will not be necessary, but should it happen, our customers can count on us.”
https://www.esmmagazine.com/retail/salling-group-advances-wo...
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salling_Group
From https://benevity.com/resources/corporate-social-responsibili... "CSR increases customer retention and loyalty: Research shows that 87% of Americans are more likely to buy a product from a company that they can align their values with, and over half of all consumers are willing to pay extra for a product if they’re buying from a company with a sturdy CSR strategy."
This is a common way people get their current accounts into debt without authorising an overdraught.
I misunderstood the nature of the book, assuming it was a list of valid card numbers. It was, of course, the opposite, so when I said to my mom “I hope they find your number in there” she replied “I hope they don’t!”
If power goes out really bad, there's some kind of major weather event in some part of the country etc 3 days is a reasonable time frame for emergency measures to be put in place
If you've only got two days supply, you may not be so generous.
They are meant to be available as reliable and functioning stores throughout a crisis period. Your go-to destination for purchasing vital goods during the crisis.