I figure that the source code is not the hard part of the IRS making this available to the public, but the interoperability with the revenue system, and its verified adherence to the current tax code. Couldn't those things still be killed by the administration even if the source code is available publicly?
BryantD · 20h ago
Yeah, absolutely. FWIW, the repo notes:
"Direct File interprets the United States' Internal Revenue Code (26 USC) as plain language questions, the answers to which should be known to taxpayers without need of external instructions or publications. Taxpayers' answers are then translated into standard tax forms and transmitted to the IRS's Modernized e-File (MeF) API, which is available for authorized public use."
So in theory it's useful now, but as you say it could easily change.
kevin_thibedeau · 20h ago
The tax code is riddled with euphemisms like EITC that don't mean what it says on the tin. There's no way normies can manage that without instructions.
kccqzy · 19h ago
I thought OP's point is that normies who have no idea what EITC is can simply answer a series of simpler questions that don't mention EITC, and the software figures out whether they can claim the EITC.
onlyrealcuzzo · 2h ago
~30-50% of the population has a pretty simple tax return that they could probably do by filling out the form directly by hand...
jandrese · 17h ago
There are also ambiguous edge cases that can't be answered until someone is audited and the IRS and the Tax attorney hash it out in court.
For example I installed Solar panels many years ago and read the exact wording on the Solar Tax Credit to try to figure out if you could include roof repairs under the panels in the credit. The wording was something like "all costs associated with a solar install". Every installer I talked to said yes, but it seemed dubious so I tried calling the IRS help line to get the answer and the help line was no help at all. A few years later and some court battles lost and that answer is now firmly a "no", making me glad I ignored the installer's advice.
How is tax prep software supposed to handle a situation like that? Some of the for pay options include "audit protection", but I don't know how far that goes. I guess you can attempt to pass all liability on to the customer, but even that seems a bit risky.
And definitely the IRS has its own jargon that doesn't always make sense to the layperson. Why, for example, is a form that you fill out once per tax year called a "schedule"? It doesn't organize anything by date or time!
andylynch · 17h ago
Schedule can also mean an organised table or list, especially in a formal context.
Legislation very often has a bunch of them at the back, referred to from the main text.
PaulDavisThe1st · 14h ago
Not to mention "Schedule 40" (and other) PVC conduit ... I assume that this too is a reference to a table of some sort.
gleenn · 19h ago
Yes but there are plenty of companies or people that may want to know how the code works and would be motivated enough to read through the code to understand it and having it there in the public makes that possible.
However, it is most likely that the people claiming EITC are the least likely to understand the information there
fitsumbelay · 19h ago
Piggybacking, I think the "hard part" also includes the decades of success that the tax prep lobby's had in protecting its business interests at the cost of US citizen's welfare. Although the number of states that provide free direct filing has grown from last year -- which I only remember to be substantially less than the 25 who do so today -- it's unclear what the problem is with the remaining 25 including DC where I live
xhevahir · 20h ago
Right, politicians and officials working on behalf of the tax-filing lobby could introduce lots of changes to the tax code with a view to making this software useless.
glookler · 20h ago
The point of open sourcing from a dying ship is that the groups that can modify this software and resell it all start from it as a baseline. Is TurboTax all lean mean code available at a low enough price while still meeting profit expectations if it needs drastic changes?
bee_rider · 19h ago
I mean… in some sense, it might be nice is the company doing your tax preparation is not too lean and mean, their whole point is to eat the hit if they screw it up, right? The math is not actually hard.
But, realistically, I guess if a self-service tax prep company messed up your taxes, they’d make sure you end up in arbitration.
NoahZuniga · 10h ago
> Taxpayers' answers are then translated into standard tax forms and transmitted to the IRS's Modernized e-File (MeF) API, which is available for authorized public use
The interoperability with the revenue system is provided by a different project, and this API is also used by turbotax and the like. It won't be going away.
The interoperability is not the hard part.
bbarnett · 35m ago
It could easily go away, if there are claims of people abusing the API, or using "unlicensed software to use the API" causing errors. By licensed, I mean "approved to use the API".
There could also be pushes to monetize the API, "Why is this service free!?". Meaning they'd likely require a need to be incorporated, setup a commercial account with them, and have payment method on file, and on and on.
My point is, I can think of dozens of sneaky ways to make that pesky API go away, and I'm not even trying.
freeone3000 · 18h ago
I do not know of this capability currently, but if it has enough for eFile, it can also be used to generate a paper return.
HPsquared · 20h ago
Sounds like a business opportunity.
nitwit005 · 19h ago
The whole point of the program was to eliminate that business opportunity.
gowld · 19h ago
Why? What's wrong with people getting paid to improve upon the government's work?
bee_rider · 19h ago
Solving a government-created problem shouldn’t be a business opportunity, the government just shouldn’t create the problem.
sitkack · 14h ago
IRS should send me an itemized bill using every piece of information it already has, I then take that to my accountant that generates a diff based on information they don't have, and then done.
You pay the bill they send you, you are done.
OskarS · 4h ago
Just, as a person outside of the US: the idea that you would need an accountant at all for a private person that isn't a billionarie, is like, crazy.
I have a reasonably simple personal economy and it takes me all of five minutes to file my taxes in Sweden. My parents have a much more complicated setup (small private business, own a couple of properties, several deductions, etc.) and it basically is pretty straight-forward for them as well, certainly they don't need an accountant.
TurboTax, Intuit and anti-tax Republicans has really fucked with the US expectation of how complicated taxes needs to be.
tekla · 4h ago
As a person who lives inside the US, I'm perfectly happy that the government doesn't have perfect information about me, and that I can spend $100 on an accountant who will help save much more money on taxes
raverbashing · 3h ago
> I'm perfectly happy that the government doesn't have perfect information about me
Yes, keep telling yourself they don't (for what it matters)
In fact if you get a W2 the IRS already have it
mauvehaus · 3h ago
If all your income is in a W2, then sure. I have a business that's about the second simplest corporate structure (I'm a single-member LLC, which is probably only slightly more complicated than a sole proprietorship). It would take very little imagination to come up with funny games one could play if one were inclined to evade taxes (I'm not, and I don't)
Just think what someone with a gazillion dollars, some trusts, and "charitable foundations" could do.
tl · 1h ago
Which means your cries for privacy only apply for rich people and you're okay with that because you have some money.
raverbashing · 1h ago
With the risk of sounding a bit redundant: privacy is important for private stuff
But if by law something needs to be known by the government: just go for it
A silly analogy: your medical info is private, but it's in your best interest that a condition like 'diabetic' or 'allergic to something' have a lower level of privacy
fanatic2pope · 12h ago
Yes but making taxes easy (or even trivial) will make people less angry about having to do them. Can't have that.
actionfromafar · 7h ago
Haha and in case anyone doesn't now, this was an actual GOP argument. :-D
acdha · 19h ago
The idea is that normal people shouldn’t have to pay to do something the government requires everyone to do. I’ve heard multiple non-Americans express amazement that people with simple jobs have to do anything other than confirm or perhaps update the data which the tax collectors already have because they weren’t thinking of it from the perspective of being a useful marketing tool for fearmongering about the government.
tombert · 18h ago
I have told this story before here, but it's relevant.
In 2021, I filed my 2020 taxes, and a few months later I get a letter from the IRS saying that I owed $8000 because I forgot to report a large stock transaction. I owed $7000 + a $1000 fine.
I wasn't mad at all about the $7000, I definitely owed that and it was just an oversight on my end, these things happen, and I was able to get the fine lowered by calling the IRS [1], so that wasn't a huge deal .
What did annoy me was why do I have to do anything? If the IRS knows about the transaction and is able to complain about me not paying enough, that suggests that they already have the information that I'm sending them. Why make me buy software and copy information from a piece of paper into that software, just for the IRS to check it against the numbers that they already have?
I understand that you might need to issue corrections, and maybe the software should exist for something like that, but it doesn't seem like it should exist otherwise.
[1] Who at least in my case was actually really polite and helpful! I had heard horror stories but that was definitely not the case for me. The people I talked to were very sympathetic and nice.
acdha · 13h ago
I’m 100% with you on that big point - the process just be “here’s what we have for you, do you have any missing data?” and 99% of people can just click “ok”. Your comment about the agent reminded me of a former coworker whose mother was an IRS auditor: she commented that most people assumed it was going to be some horrible ordeal and were surprised a) that she was a normal suburban mom rather than the Gestapo and b) ended up finding deductions such that close to half of the people she talked to came out ahead.
throw678937 · 18h ago
They probably know less than you think. (Are you selling stuff at the farmer's market for cash? Did you gift your coin collection to your grandkids?) Making everyone file reduces fraud somewhat – but whether that's worth the country's time and effort is a different story.
tombert · 16h ago
You might be right, are there any numbers on that? I feel like primarily-cash businesses already underreport their income.
icedchai · 12h ago
You might have other information they don't have. Example: private transactions that resulted in a capital loss and would offset that gain.
tombert · 12h ago
Sure, hence why I would be perfectly happy for them have a system where I can amend stuff. I'm just saying that the default should be to "send me letter in mail, I verify it looks fine, I sign it and send it back". The entire process for most people could be like ten minutes.
tekla · 4h ago
It IS 10 mins for most people.
PopAlongKid · 17h ago
> If the IRS knows about the transaction and is able to complain about me not paying enough, that suggests that they already have the information that I'm sending them.
You mistakenly assume that simply knowing what is on the 1099-B form is sufficient to determine your tax on the gain. They don't know if you are married or single or head of household (filing status) in the current tax year. They don't know what some of your itemized deductions and other income not reported to them might be (which in turn, along with filing status, determines what marginal tax bracket you are in). They don't know if you are actually just a nominee for someone else's income. These are just a few examples. They don't know any of this stuff until you tell them by filing your complete return.
xp84 · 17h ago
> They don't know if you are married or single or head of household (filing status) in the current tax year. They don't know what some of your itemized deductions and other income not reported to them might be
I think you're misinterpreting the GP's point. Clearly, at least in our current system, it is essential to tell the IRS the parts of the return that they don't already know such as what are your expenses, deductions, marital status, etc.
But the absurd thing is that the capture of the IRS by the paid tax prep scammers has prevented them from simply showing you what's on your tax transcripts and having you click "Agree" or "Modify" for each one. Instead, you get your own copy of the 1099-B, 1099-DIV, 1099-INTs, and are administered a pointless "honesty test" to see if you'll type in the same numbers they have, or be automatically punished.
Obviously, Direct File was ideally situated to offer this feature since IRS has the data themselves, and simply populating the numbers is a highly efficient way of ingesting the data into your return.
rsti0000 · 13h ago
It’s not an honesty test, it’s a result of how the US income tax system evolved. Originally the IRS had far less data and everyone filed paper returns. For example, it was only in 2008 that Congress required brokers to track and report cost basis on 1099s to cut down on people overstating their basis to decrease their cap gains.
Under Biden, the IRS tried to make w2s and 1099s available. If you log into the IRS website with your information, you can download the w2s and 1099s the Service has in your name.
Antitax activists have fought these steps every step of the way because the less annoying tax filing is, the less people will buy their antitax arguments.
The IRS isn’t captured by these predatory tax preparers, Congress is. The IRS can’t do a lot on data without Congress specifically authorizing it. And the Republican Party is in bed with the antitax activists who are in bed with the tax preparation companies.
sokoloff · 3h ago
Tax account transcripts have been available long before Biden was president.
Use Form 4506-T to request them.
sokoloff · 3h ago
If it’s for shares bought before 2011, they don’t even have the basis.
(They can detect that you had a sale for which they got a 1099-B but you didn’t list on your Schedule D. That doesn’t mean they have enough information to fix it.)
tombert · 25m ago
The shares were RSUs granted to me in 2019.
tombert · 17h ago
I'd be surprised if they don't know that I'm married, considering I've mentioned that I'm married on every tax return for the last nine years, so they could send me a form with all the stuff that they do know about and ask if they need me to correct anything, or if I have anything else to declare. They could ask "Are you still married? Are you still married to the same person?" and update stuff.
braebo · 19h ago
Nothing but that’s not what was happening.
mystified5016 · 17h ago
I wouldn't say interop is a huge deal, the main time and cost sink is translating the recursive Gordian knots of tax law into a logically cohesive structure that can be evaluated programmatically. And then you (ideally) must prove its correctness.
Imagine pair programming with a tax lawyer. I'd rather eat my own hands.
rsti0000 · 13h ago
DirectFile wasn’t meant to handle complicated edge cases. Most filers have a w2 and a few 1099s, use the standard deduction, and claim a few common credits (e.g., child and earned-income). They could file for free in a few minutes with directfile.
That's reactive programming in Java, where you return a callback to be run when an operation completes.
The giveaway is the Mono<T> return type.
deepsun · 18h ago
My eyeballs bleed, and I'm pretty comfortable with Java for many years.
I see the most of it stems from reactive-style programming (reactor.core.publisher.Mono).
Maybe they just tried to fit into one screen? Anyway I'd ask to simplify it, if I was a their team lead.
pjc50 · 16h ago
Is this what people have to do when they don't have the C# async/await autogenerated state machine?
winrid · 12h ago
Yup. Although to be honest it probably doesn't need to be reactive.
evantbyrne · 18h ago
The atomics are goofy, but reactor can often lead to messy code structure when you actually need sequential blocking behavior.
mcv · 18h ago
I've seen similar things, in Java as well as some other languages. It's obviously not the preferred way of doing it.
readthenotes1 · 17h ago
Unreadable+undebuggable has been the preferred way of doing it for as long as I have seen software
seattle_spring · 17h ago
Seems perfectly readable to me, and I haven't used Java professionally in over a decade. What specifically do you find problematic?
jryan49 · 18h ago
I can tell you as a person working in a spring boot webflux shop that is pretty bad code. You really don’t want to nest that much. Using atomic references outside the reactive flow is a huge red flag that they don’t know how to program in webflux properly. Not that webflux is easy to use at all and the dx is garbage.
maeln · 14m ago
> Not that webflux is easy to use at all and the dx is garbage
My experience with pretty much any Java framework ... It's sad because I do think (especially since Java 8) that Java is a great language for many things. But the community as this insane tendency to create incredibly convoluted pattern-on-top-of-pattern tooling.
okeuro49 · 17h ago
With virtual threads it's difficult to see WebFlux being used in new projects.
hk1337 · 13h ago
I saw an internal “sso” auth app that iterated a byte array and concatenated the values into a string instead of base64 encoding it when I worked at HP/HPE/DXC
tomashubelbauer · 17h ago
> .onErrorResume
I dislike Java but if it can get me back to the On Error Resume Next days I might reconsider.
koolba · 19h ago
It is if you’re doing government style work and you want have a job for life creating code that nobody else can read.
Or if you’re in the business of selling extremely wide aspect ratio monitors.
tempest_ · 17h ago
It is nested sure but the entire thing fits on 1080p monitor
timewizard · 16h ago
Well... depending on your default level of zoom.
After staring at code for 12 hours a day for a few decades my zoom is 125% by default.
90s_dev · 15h ago
Careful, at this rate your zoom level will be an unreadable 900% after only a few centuries...
77pt77 · 16h ago
Better make those monitors curved
tomsmeding · 15h ago
Looks like callback hell, but in Java. Async/await would solve it, but it's Java.
mystified5016 · 17h ago
Yes and no. This is a common pattern, but implemented very lazily. Most of this can (and probably should) be refactored out to separate classes/functions.
But no, I don't think this would faze most Java devs. It's ugly and bad practice, but more or less acceptable depending on personal taste. It works, at least.
Point of interest: LLMs tend to go too far in the opposite direction with code like this. They will break everything apart into functions or classes, even trivial one-line lambdas. I find that even more obnoxious than the monstrosity you linked.
xyst · 18h ago
If you are a non-Java developer, it does look daunting. But in my opinion it’s much much better use of the Java streams api and reactor library that I have seen compared to most shitty corp firms.
qingcharles · 12h ago
Wow, that's frustrating code. I feel vindicated in using an ultrawide to code with. When I mentioned on here I use it because sometimes you have to work on code with super-deep indents I got downvoted to negative infinity for shitty code management.
speed_spread · 7h ago
Fuck no, it's not. But I've seen it because it gets promoted by some smartass tech lead chasing so called webscale performance. But they never do comparative benchmarks against regular blocking code for fear that it would demonstrate the true nature of their head trip. Then they leave to go shit elsewhere and leave other people to deal with the consequences of their hubris.
pimlottc · 19h ago
Aside from the code, there's also a ton of great design documents and notes under /docs/design [0], including detailed process diagrams for many of the user flows (unfortunately not directly viewable online since they're within zip files; see flow1.zip and flow2.zip)
>But as I told the team as the end closed in, “We took a pipedream, and made it a policy choice.” No one can claim with a straight face that Direct File is impossible anymore; bringing it back requires only that our elected leaders make a different choice.
>What I mourn the most, though, is the dissolution of the team, the disregard for the vast impact they were poised and eager to deliver. The team itself is what I am proudest of from my time working on Direct File. Their manic dedication to the mission. The care they consistently took to get it right. The trust and love they had for each other.
Better fork it quick before some ideologue deletes it and threatens to imprison anyone who looks at it.
dylan604 · 20h ago
This is a service. What happens if some ideologue turns off whatever is listening on the government's end? Unless this forked version will then print out a bunch of forms for someone to physically mail in, owning this software without being able to communicate to a digital host is useless.
BHSPitMonkey · 19h ago
> Unless this forked version will then print out a bunch of forms for someone to physically mail in
Well yes, this is in essence what tax return preparation software has always been; The end result is a completed set of values to fill into the boxes of form 1040 (and whatever additional forms are deemed to be required), which can then be filed electronically or written/printed on paper to be returned at an office or by mail.
letters90 · 7h ago
Not in other countries besides the US. Haven't seen a printout since I started doing taxes.
rsti0000 · 13h ago
The IRS accepts efilings in a prescribed format so that isnt a danger. If you look at a tax transcript produced from efiling vs a paper return, there is no material difference besides the fields related to how they were submitted.
dylan604 · 12h ago
I have no idea how I'd go about looking at an efiling. Does it essentially send a PDF export or does it hit an API and provide the data in a specified format? I could see how it would make sense for a giant government agency to want the equivalent of a PDF to hand off to humans so that it's "just like everything else".
dataflow · 14h ago
If you're actually worried about this, you should be cloning locally, not forking.
90s_dev · 18h ago
Or just glance at the code out of idle curiosity and move on with our lives?
timewizard · 16h ago
Never turn down an opportunity to spew breathless hyperbole into Hacker News!
It's also fun that, because this is from the US, they can't just use CC0, but instead need to clarify that this must be public domain, separately from the worldwide CC0.
runako · 19h ago
Another way of saying this: Creative Commons, based in California, USA, did not publish a license that can be used by one of the largest domestic authors of software.
Less snarkily, I do wonder about the discrepancy there.
gowld · 19h ago
Category Error.
Public Domain is not a license. It is a state of being.
Creative Commons is a worldwide organization, not a jurisdiction-specfic organization. Creative Commons does not have the authority to harmonize laws worldwide.
In other words, think of Copyright. A Copyright holder can apply any license they like, and change the licenses for new versions whenever they like. Public Domain is explicit forfeiting the Copyright, which means authors cannot enforce any license (and anyone can just take their work and declare it it's theirs, apply licenses etc).
PS: AFAIK, however, Authorship rights are different from Copyright, and cannot be given/passed as Copyrights, at least in US.
globular-toast · 7h ago
It's not that they can't, it's just pointless to offer a licence for something that's in the public domain.
Also it's important to remember these works are not in the public domain because someone declared them to be, they are simply because they are works carried out by the US government. Similar to how copyright is automatic, it's not applied only when you put the copyright symbol, that's just informational.
timhigins · 16h ago
> Exempted Code
> Not all source code, documentation and metadata used in the development of Direct File is included in this repository. Specifically, any code or data that is considered Personally Identifiable Information (PII), Federal Tax Information (FTI), Sensitive But Unclassified (SBU), or source code developed for National Security Systems (NSS), as defined in 40 U.S.C. § 11103, is exempt. Due to these restrictions, certain pieces of functionality have been removed or rewritten.
Very curious about what these pieces are that were removed
ronbenton · 19h ago
Sadly this program is being killed by the current admin. This repo looks great. The scala fact graph is super neat and there is clearly a lot of care that went into making the tutorial for it.
ryandrake · 19h ago
I'm sure everyone working on this knew it was doomed before the first line of code was written, and that it would be killed as soon as the next (R) was in charge. It was a great accomplishment to get working software released before that happened, but I'm sure nobody was kidding themselves into thinking it would last. The pay-to-file tax lobby is too strong and corrupt.
afavour · 18h ago
I don't know about that. Inertia is a strong force but it goes in both directions. Had this administration been a Democratic one four years might be long enough to establish it strongly enough that it would be very difficult to remove. Look at the Affordable Care Act. Imperfect though it was, Republicans have pledged over and over that they're going to get rid of it but when it power it seems they just can't.
ryandrake · 18h ago
I hope you're right, but this administration so far has found almost no limit to the number of projects, lives, roles and institutions it can destroy or at least attempt to destroy. And the party that is supposed to be acting as the Opposition is basically letting them do whatever they want unhindered. Unless you consider "holding up little signs and making frowny-faces" to count as "doing something."
meepmorp · 15h ago
> Opposition is basically letting them do whatever they want unhindered
what do you propose they do, being entirely out of power?
netsharc · 14h ago
I feel like the Dems need to be doing a lot of PR, the public needs to hear them attack the Low-IQ autocrat every day. Maybe they're doing this but the media aren't reporting it, in which case they need to engage with the media better...
Without this engagement, even if it's just futile noisemaking, the voters will surely think in the next election cycle "why should we vote for you, when you haven't done anything the last 2 years?"
shigawire · 13h ago
What do you see as "the media"? The media landscape is so fractured, everyone has their own "feed".
I have seen Dems constantly attacking Trump, if you haven't consider the news you consume may simply be different. There is not one mainstream to push anymore.
johnnyanmac · 13h ago
My main media is Reddit, Youtube, and a few other sites so I do in fact see some fight coming out of the D's. There should be much more given the severity of these various issues, but I see some hope. It is sad that legacy media has almost completely given up on reporting most of this stuff, though.
as for the "mainstream social media", I'm not sure how effective the instagrams, tiktoks, etc. are at delivering these messages. I know some congressmen on are on there. Perhaps not enough, though. Or perhaps they don't get how to reach their people.
johnnyanmac · 13h ago
I think it's less about trying to get wins (most understand that congress dems are the minority) and more about resisting these anti-citizen acts as much as possible. Having 4 or 5 democrats vote on an R bill a few months back really put a nasty taste in people's mouths. Among all the crazy cabinet appointments that some voted on
Basically, the democrats want fighters. We're well past bi-partisan tasks where we should just faciliate any kind of bill that comes up. Because very few are reasonable.
bsder · 12h ago
> Basically, the democrats want fighters.
Trump called and got Jan 6th.
Democrats called and nobody could be bothered to show up to vote.
brutal_chaos_ · 10h ago
Practically, anything besides what Schumer does?
PaulDavisThe1st · 14h ago
In the Senate, they could force filibusters on everything, and impose maximal procedural roadblocks on everything. They did this successfully for a Duckworth-sponsored anti-trans bill, which could not muster 60 votes to break the filibuster.
In the House, or rather out of the house, they could get their media circus in 10,000% better shape than it is in right now, and consistently deliver a powerful, viral, troll-y, and savvy message about Trump, 8 times a day, across many different media environments.
ryandrake · 13h ago
This has veered fully into politics, but... In addition to that bare minimum obstruction they should be doing but aren't, they could also be working on the policy and people that they see winning in 2028. Where is the Democrat's own "Project 2029" document? The Heritage Foundation has been publishing their detailed, written plans since at least Reagan. Where is the Democrat's version of Trump that can win back rural populists? Why isn't he on TV every day hyping up their base like Trump hypes up his base?
johnnyanmac · 12h ago
It's about the IRS, so politics is inevitable.
I do agree that that is the biggest issue in both DNC and RNC though. There's been a clear divide between what DNC wants to run and what the actual democrats want out of the party. Polls suggest from the latter that Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (AOC) is one of the biggest role models of a proper opponent in 2028, but it's been clear the DNC has been fighting against that for almost a decade now, for a variety of reasons.
RNC has a similar issue, once Trump is gone. There's already cracks forming in various different interests of republicans, but they all loosely rally around Trump. If/when Trump kicks the bucket, I don't see who can hold that cult of personality. Vance has very low charisma, and Mike Johnson seems too establishment (for voters that very much voted against establishment). I don't really see a protégé that is carrying whatever that MAGA mindset people want out of the movement.
wavemode · 12h ago
> There's been a clear divide between what DNC wants to run and what the actual democrats want out of the party
There's a pretty easy way to reconcile this - run a fair primary election. Rigging it against Sanders in 2016, and not running one at all in 2024, both expectedly led to disaster. You're never gonna win if you don't even have the full support of your own party.
I feel like this is a correction made if not in bad faith then to muddy the waters. Some states held primary elections, others canceled them, and the incumbent didn't participate in any meaningful way. So yes, many states held 2024 dem primary elections, but not all the states, and the party did not treat it as a legitimate primary.
cj · 12h ago
I tend to believe that the MAGA movement will stop and end when Trump is out of power. I think people will return to being okay with boring politics and not attention grabbing personalities once he exits the picture. On both sides. That's also why I don't think AOC has a chance, she will have trouble appealing to moderates and conservatives.
PaulDavisThe1st · 11h ago
Notice that Trump explicitly ran on disclaiming Project 2025, even though once elected Project 2025 has been a solid 50% or more of the organizing principles for his administration. So it's a bit misleading to suggest that some Democratic equivalent ("Project 2029", say) would necessarily be part of the electoral platform and outreach. Of course, it would be nice if it was.
mindslight · 11h ago
No, this isn't politics. It's basic patriotism. I share or have shared a good portion of the criticisms that Trump is using to rile people up. Just because he is talking about these issues does not mean that he is doing anything meaningful about them. It's the same old pattern of politicians pretending to care about people's concerns, to just steal, loot, and enable more corporate control for sponsors. The differences with Trump are his degree of shamelessness and that his sponsors seem much less aligned with overall American interests.
egypturnash · 12h ago
fllibuster so hard the majority finally decides to nuke it
PaulDavisThe1st · 14h ago
The House budget bill is likely to separate more people from health insurance coverage than the ACA increased it by. It may not be an explicitly "repeal the ACA" act, but practically speaking, it will have a similar effect.
analogwzrd · 15h ago
A couple of decades ago tax code transparency and making it easier and cheaper to file your taxes would have been a very Republican policy. Point taken that the current administration is particularly destructive, but I wouldn't expect Democrats to be very staunch in support this either. The tax/accountant lobby would influence both parties.
shigawire · 13h ago
But Democrats created the program? Why do you expect they wouldn't support it?
johnnyanmac · 12h ago
We've clearly had a more neoliberal congress body in the last decade. So their principles (or outright bribes) to focus on privatization of services would get in the way of such acts.
paleotrope · 10h ago
Tax return on a postcard is still in the Republican area of ideas, but they can't seem to get enough actual Congressional Republicans to come on board. It's frustrating. The problem to me is that the Democrats have become so uncompetitive in large swathes of the country, that too many center/moderates/status quos adapt Republican cover to get into office.
I'm sure Democrats can complain about their Senators in the same language.
standardUser · 9h ago
It is not typical for an (R) administration to aggressively reverse every decision made by their predecessor. Historically, citizens, businesses and government agencies could all expect significantly more stability from one administration to the next.
pjc50 · 16h ago
I don't think so - the destructiveness of the current administration is really unprecedented.
90s_dev · 11h ago
All software has an expiration date.
andreygrehov · 14h ago
The bill was introduced by the Republican party (Nick Langworthy, co-sponsored by William Timmons). Don't spread misleading/fake information.
junar · 11h ago
No, I think you have it mixed up. It's quite clear that the authority came from the 2022 Inflation Reduction Act, which was was well known to have passed without a single Republican vote. It's also quite clear that in the context of the top-level comment, "this program" mentioned means the Direct File as it operates, not the release of source code.
> The Inflation Reduction Act (IRA) was signed into law in August 2022.1 Section 10301(1)(B) of the IRS provided the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) with $15 million to establish a task force to design an IRS-run, free direct electronic filing (e-file) system commonly referred to as “Direct File” ...
> Please note: As of two weeks ago, I no longer work at the IRS. I am writing solely in my personal capacity.
It's too bad the current Administration is going to kill DirectFile and has fired all the people who were working on it.
ctkhn · 20h ago
Love that the repo has two commits and they're both "initial commit"
dylan604 · 20h ago
i've done that when i forgot to add some necessary files in the initial initial commit. since the adding the forgotten files did not include any changes warranting a different message, it lets me know i was a knucklehead and the commits are meant be considered the same commit. it's much faster than looking up to see if there's a way to amend an existing commit with additional files, and then going through the process of actually doing it. my use of git is add/commit/push/clone/switch/fetch. after that, it's 100% look it up and hope i'm not going to bork my repo by following some SO thread
lcnPylGDnU4H9OF · 19h ago
For what it's worth, you can still do it with those commands, though I understand part of the point is that you don't necessarily remember all of the options for them. But in this case, it should be simple:
Unlike amend, you can target an older commit rather than just the very-most-recent (great if you're separating the rename/refactor from the rewrite) and you can delay the second step of actually changing history until you're sure stuff is in a good state.
This is particularly useful for the review process: All the changes during the review process can be "fixup" commits, allowing reviewers to easily see what did (or didn't) change since their last interaction. At the same time, all the fiddly fixes and back-and-forth stuff won't be in the final history, only a smaller number of "real" commits that future maintainers would care about.
The government required them to scrub the commit history. Hilarious that they used that message for the second commit.
bigon · 4h ago
Wait, the USA/IRS is not providing a free platform for individuals to fill their tax?
PopAlongKid · 36m ago
Anyone can download files for all the forms and schedules, then fill print and mail for the cost of postage.
paxys · 20h ago
TurboTax isn't "trying to kill" it they have successfully killed it. Intuit donated $1M to Trump's inaugration fund, and the Trump administation subsequently ended support for Direct File (which I'm assuming is why it was open sourced). The IRS will no longer accept returns directly. 18F itself was disbanded by doge, so even though the code is open source no one is going to continue to develop it.
For the 2024 tax season yes. Funding bill removes it for 2025 onward.
jadbox · 19h ago
Sigh. How much did cutting direct file really save?!
kelnos · 17h ago
Irrelevant. Those in power don't actually care about saving money. They care about doing what their deep-pocketed donors want them to do, as well as fulfilling their ideology, however misguided and backward it may be.
paxys · 17h ago
It was never about saving. The new budget literally adds $2.4 trillion to the federal defecit.
onlyrealcuzzo · 1h ago
It adds $2.4T MORE than otherwise would've been added (which is already a lot) over a decade.
So it's adding an extra $240B in deficit per year (on top of an already ~6-7% of GDP deficit).
thuanao · 16h ago
It was cut because tax preparing companies pay the politicians to cut it.
pjc50 · 16h ago
It makes it more expensive. But the important figure was the million dollar bribe.
janeerie · 19h ago
Yes, but you may want to reword this part, since it implies that DF is already shut down:
"The IRS will no longer accept returns directly."
pimlottc · 19h ago
> "The IRS will no longer accept returns directly."
Where are you finding that quote, I don't see it on the Direct File homepage [0]
EDIT: Ah, I see now, it was from paxys's original post [1], I assumed it was meant to be an official quote from the IRS somewhere.
Interesting, thanks for reinforcing the point. I would note the two columns 'From Individuals' (which includes all employees) vs. the 'From Organization' column. Worth noting that the R-affiliated GOPAC is the only listed recipient that actually recieved funds from the organization.
Of course, this page doesn't include the $1M inauguration donation, so it's still incomplete.
aksss · 6h ago
I suppose we all see what we want to see and have reasons to explain away any dissonance. $1m to an inauguration committee for an already elected president might counterbalance the disproportionate donations to democrats during campaign season from execs, employees, and their family members. I mean, bet on the wrong horse, amends must be made, right? Money goes where the power is. If it hadn’t been Trump, Intuit would be working Joe Kamala. The data is the data.
cebert · 11h ago
This code base is clean and well-crafted. I appreciate the extensive documentation. It’s unfortunate that Direct File was affected by budget cuts.
nickthegreek · 22m ago
budget cuts had nothing to do with it. this was a lobbied choice.
Other than the flourish of adding some Scala to enterprisey Java there is absolutely nothing atypical about this bog enterprisey application. It’s a JS/TS/Java app, nothing else stands out.
Listing every config language and a few lines of CI or whatever scripts shit is misleading.
I see nothing other than typical boring enterprise/big gov crap here (which is fine, and expected).
czhu12 · 16h ago
Given this project is being drained of resources by the new admin, is anyone in the know able to comment on how hard this would be to take, and stand up, as a competitor to turbo tax?
Presumably, any Intuit competitors will be given a 10 year headstart worth many millions, maybe billions?
foolswisdom · 15h ago
Is there a reason you'd need to do so? What is freetaxusa.com missing that direct file gives you (other than the fact that direct file is free and supported by the government itself)?
TsiCClawOfLight · 7h ago
Expat support.
furyg3 · 4h ago
If anyone has any tips for the most cost effective way for expats to file, please share them here.
I'm doing it all by hand because I'm tired of going through the 'free' apps and entering in all my details, and when I get ready to file it end up being hundreds of dollars to file since the other forms (extra 1040 schedules, 2555, etc) are not included.
d0gsg0w00f · 15h ago
Where does it say that this project is impacted by the 11% layoffs?
BrandoElFollito · 17h ago
What is the core reason for the government in the US to not provide a simple online tax filing portal like we generally have in Europe.
It is pre-filled with the known incomes so for the best majority of people filling their taxes is a 1 minute exercise.
This also helps, I guess, to have the taxes flow in.
tallowen · 14h ago
The US tax code isn't created to work like this. Direct file asked many questions about things like dependent children, whether you're blind and whether you have an HSA - all things that are relevant to your taxes that aren't actually available to the government right now.
Secondly, there is the issue of State / Local taxes - the IRS only receives federal tax data making it hard to automatically fill out the whole tax return since efiling products tend to file federal / state taxes together.
additionally, the US has (one of?) the most complex tax systems in the world. In part b/c most of it is carve outs...on behalf of various lobbyist groups / catering to specific voting blocks.
alemanek · 15h ago
That is still no excuse.
The majority of the population of the US claims the standard deduction and has all their income in the form of W2 or 1099 which is reported to the IRS by the employer. Those people can be served by a return free filing system.
The minority which have more complicated taxes can still file like they do today. But even adding on investment income and housing related deductions the IRS likely has enough information to calculate what is owed.
We shouldn’t let perfect be the enemy of better. I know you weren’t arguing that point but just because the tax code is complex doesn’t mean it is complex for everyone’s situation
weberer · 17h ago
Entering your income is easy enough if you're a salaried employee with a W2 form. The time consuming part is searching for and entering deductions. The tax code is ridiculously complex and there are forms for all sorts of deductions.
jonas21 · 16h ago
90% of people take the standard deduction, which takes maybe 10 seconds to enter.
throw678937 · 12h ago
Even if you're pulling in 100% of your income through a W-2 job and you're sure you're not itemizing, you have to consider excluded income, above-the-line deductions, and refundable and non-refundable credits. Oh, and do you live alone or might you claim a dependent,[1] and on and on and on. People spend their whole lives on this stuff and still don't understand the half of it.
The same reason the US moves more of the worlds money through commercial and investment services hosted here.
Ask anyone in the EU who has lived in one country and earned a paycheck from a different one.
Anyways, give it time, the EU is currently working to make it's tax system more complicated to solve some of the long standing continental issues, and to make the EU system more like the US one.
pjc50 · 16h ago
The EU doesn't have a federal tax system for individuals.
timewizard · 6h ago
The EU has tons of binding tax agreements.
pjc50 · 4h ago
But individuals do not pay tax to the EU.
vjvjvjvjghv · 12h ago
Weren't they also working on a system that would send you a prefilled return with all information filled in the IRS already has?
cookingmyserver · 17h ago
I enjoyed walking through some of their docs which documented decisions and deliverables. Thought for sure it would have just been a dump of source code with little to no context.
colelyman · 16h ago
I went to the link thinking that I could now file my taxes with the IRS through GitHub, which I honestly have mixed feelings about.
BHSPitMonkey · 16h ago
That's an idea... Make a fork, add a file at taxpayers/${SSN}.yaml describing your return in terms of income/deductions/circumstances, make sure it lints successfully, and then submit a PR for the IRS to review. If it's merged, CI/CD initiates a bank payment/withdrawal. If you get audited, resolve the conflicts and update the PR.
eamann · 20h ago
It's a bit disappointing that a seemingly official project isn't using commit signing for verification and non-repudiation. It's open source, great! But it's also pretty massive (i.e. hard to review everything) and the chance of a bad actor sticking code in something so critical as tax filings.
deepsun · 18h ago
Kinda. Since it's Public Domain, there's little to no use in signing the code, because they explicitly forfeited any rights to it.
Public Domain means you can legally take their code, riddle it with malware, and distribute, claiming that's the real and true Direct File source code, and you are its author. What you do with malware is a different legal issue of course.
So I'm not sure proving you are commit owner by signing it is really helpful if anyone can do it as well, and there's no copyright holder to decide who's right.
justinrubek · 17h ago
Copyright doesn't have anything to do with it, even remotely. I don't care who owns it or who claims to own it. But it may be useful to verify that the commit came from the government.
deepsun · 13h ago
But how do you verify?
Let's say you see a green checkmark on GitHub that confirms the commit was really made by GitHub user @totally_legit_government_absolutely_not_hacker.
Unless you already have their public GPG key in your private keychain, and you marked it as "trusted" previously, there's not really much more info to that.
UPDATE: besides, the government is like a million people, some of them are malicious actors.
pfg_ · 15h ago
You don't know what they used internally. There are two commits on github which just dump the code from whatever they used for version control for the past two years, and no further development will take place.
dylan604 · 19h ago
what could it really do though? any discrepancies will just be settled in an audit. of course, you are providing name, address, SSN, bank account info, but what malevolent entity doesn't already have that data about you anyways? besides, trust us, we're the government is good enough already! /s
yonran · 18h ago
What would it take for an individual or small business to run a version of this locally? To file, you need an MeF account with IRS; does the IRS grant those freely? And to import W2s and 1099s, it seems that there is a DataImportService interface but unfortunately there is no implementation and the APIs to IRS are not public.
If the Biden administration wanted to break the tax software oligopoly, they should have focused on making the government’s own interfaces open.
piker · 18h ago
> libs
Guys I knew it
WorldPeas · 9h ago
fork this repo so you can own the libs
skrebbel · 20h ago
Wow public domain license! Smart move, I assume those disgruntled devs who "joined a project to explore the “future of tax filing” in the private sector" can now easily fork it and compete with TurboTax directly (with, I hope, a much better product at a lower price). Normally that'd feel a bit scummy but in this case I can't fault them for it.
Here's to hoping they can outcompete TurboTax so brutally that Intuit won't be able to pay for all those lobbyists anymore.
Rebelgecko · 20h ago
IIRC public domain is actually the "default" for code released by the government
haiku2077 · 20h ago
Yes, works of the US Federal Government are public domain. It gets complicated when state governments, contractors, etc. are involved, but Direct File was in-house work by USDS/18F.
BHSPitMonkey · 19h ago
FTA:
> Releasing Direct File’s source code demonstrates that the IRS is fulfilling its obligations under the SHARE IT Act[1] (three weeks ahead of schedule!).
Although it is written in the "LICENSE" file for purposes of uniformity and GitHub compatibility, a dedication to the Public Domain is not a "license". As you can see, they waive all their rights to claim copyright protection, and therefore, no license is possible; no license is necessary to use it for any purpose.
And yes, "As a work of the US Government" it is dedicated to the Public Domain by law.
gowld · 19h ago
TurboTax already has competitors.
insane_dreamer · 9h ago
I wonder whether Cash App's free filing service (used it for the first time last year and it was very good even for my somewhat complicated taxes) is based on this?
> The source code is only public because of federal law
I doubt contributions are welcome
piracyrules · 9h ago
Let's not forget how IRS only goes after the small fishes in the pond. Billionaires get a free pass from them all the time.
thuanao · 16h ago
In my experience the paper forms are so much easier and more reliable than using tax software. A pen and a form just works. No account logins and passwords, no janky UI, no advertisements, no issues saving your progress... The instructions are much better too. Each box is numbered and there's an instruction manual detailing what to put in that box. If you make mistakes the IRS will simply correct you.
pfg_ · 15h ago
The problem I had with the papers is they don't tell you when you need to have another form. Guided question software will ask questions to determine if you need forms.
tonymet · 19h ago
IRS does something good.
ITT: WhAt if "the administration" (we don't speak his name) tries to prevent us from using it.
Guys, Trump isn't anti- everything you like. He doesn't give a crap about open source.
prophesi · 19h ago
Intuit and their millions in lobbying efforts might change the administration's thoughts on that.
BHSPitMonkey · 18h ago
• IRS Direct File launched in 2024 after being created via the Biden administration's Inflation Reduction Act in 2024.
• The Trump administration is preparing to sign into law a new budget that orders the immediate termination of the Direct File program (see SEC. 112207 "TASK FORCE ON THE TERMINATION OF DIRECT FILE").
• 18F, the agency within the federal government probably most responsible for championing and promoting open source development (and just all-around providing good digital services at a significantly lower cost), was eliminated by the Trump administration in March.
I know that you are probably a busy person, like many of us here; Still, I would encourage you to take some time each week to become informed about what is (or isn't) happening in politics rather than just offering knee-jerk reactions based on partisan feelings. It really is important.
const_cast · 17h ago
Except that Trump has already prevented us from using it. He axed it, beginning next tax season.
It's not a boogie-man, Trump really does just suck. He's anti like, anything even good-adjacent.
lagniappe · 17h ago
I see you've discovered the reddit-to-HN flywheel.
vagab0nd · 17h ago
Ok we now have "law is code".
When can we have "code is law"? Write the code as source of truth and generate the law from it.
timewizard · 16h ago
The law has better properties when it comes to undefined behavior than code does.
seattle_spring · 17h ago
That's what a smart contract is meant to represent, and they get taken advantage of every single day.
internet_points · 19h ago
> Direct File also incorporates the Fact Graph, a declarative, XML-based knowledge graph data structure that is designed to reason about incomplete information, such as a partially completed tax return. The Fact Graph is written in the Scala programming language; it runs on the JVM on the backend and is transpiled via Scala.js to run on the client as well. Direct File's Fact Graph is not domain-specific, and it may be useful to revenue agencies and as a reference for business rules engine implementations.
"A Fact Graph is a DAG, just like Excel." [1]
A DAG won't work for everything! For example, the advance premium tax credit (i.e., the means-tested Obamacare health premium subsidy) has a circular relationship with the above-the-line deduction that self-employed people can take for healthcare costs. The IRS says you can iterate until you get stable values. [2]
You could also just sign up and read it on their site, and consider subscribing.
Journalism is labor
joshmanders · 17h ago
I'd agree typically but paywalling open source government software just to talk about it is wild behavior.
cAtte_ · 17h ago
how is the software being paywalled here?
joshmanders · 17h ago
They're talking about it but to actually see the thing they're talking about you have to pay before the part of the article that links to it is clickable
cAtte_ · 15h ago
or you can just google it? it's not like the source code is exclusively held by 404media and you must pay them to view it, or something. would you have the same opinion if e.g. the article was the same but just didn't link to the repo?
90s_dev · 18h ago
The ad model won.
rsingel · 18h ago
If you want indie publications to survive, please reconsider punishing sites that are sign-up walled.
xp84 · 17h ago
If they intend for a mass market to read their articles, indie publications should find a way to sell a user an article for a fair price. Especially in the context of coming from a news aggregator site, it's absurd that I'm going to buy a recurring subscription for Tax Software Quarterly, Yacht Week, Greg's TV Reviews etc. The number of distinct domains I click through to from HN alone would be hundreds of dollars a month if I'm starting subscriptions for each one.
I hate and block ads, since they literally screw up the functioning of the page now, so I don't think they should "just have ads and be open" -- but I think expecting average non-journalists to sign up for subscriptions to multiple "national newspapers" and a half dozen news magazines is absurd, which is why people here don't like paywalls, and bypass them wherever possible.
brendanyounger · 12h ago
I think the video streaming services are a good model to follow. You go on Prime Video and see videos from several decades, dozens of cable & broadcast networks, and hundreds or thousands of distributors and production companies. The rights are a mess, but that's all hidden from view. Now if only text-based media could operate like that...
cAtte_ · 15h ago
if someone is unwilling to pay for access to an entire collection of articles, i'd find it very unlikely that they pay for a single article. unless it's an outrageously low price like 10 cents or something
Saying Goodbye - https://chrisgiven.com/2025/06/saying-goodbye/
"Direct File interprets the United States' Internal Revenue Code (26 USC) as plain language questions, the answers to which should be known to taxpayers without need of external instructions or publications. Taxpayers' answers are then translated into standard tax forms and transmitted to the IRS's Modernized e-File (MeF) API, which is available for authorized public use."
So in theory it's useful now, but as you say it could easily change.
For example I installed Solar panels many years ago and read the exact wording on the Solar Tax Credit to try to figure out if you could include roof repairs under the panels in the credit. The wording was something like "all costs associated with a solar install". Every installer I talked to said yes, but it seemed dubious so I tried calling the IRS help line to get the answer and the help line was no help at all. A few years later and some court battles lost and that answer is now firmly a "no", making me glad I ignored the installer's advice.
How is tax prep software supposed to handle a situation like that? Some of the for pay options include "audit protection", but I don't know how far that goes. I guess you can attempt to pass all liability on to the customer, but even that seems a bit risky.
And definitely the IRS has its own jargon that doesn't always make sense to the layperson. Why, for example, is a form that you fill out once per tax year called a "schedule"? It doesn't organize anything by date or time!
Legislation very often has a bunch of them at the back, referred to from the main text.
However, it is most likely that the people claiming EITC are the least likely to understand the information there
But, realistically, I guess if a self-service tax prep company messed up your taxes, they’d make sure you end up in arbitration.
The interoperability with the revenue system is provided by a different project, and this API is also used by turbotax and the like. It won't be going away.
The interoperability is not the hard part.
There could also be pushes to monetize the API, "Why is this service free!?". Meaning they'd likely require a need to be incorporated, setup a commercial account with them, and have payment method on file, and on and on.
My point is, I can think of dozens of sneaky ways to make that pesky API go away, and I'm not even trying.
You pay the bill they send you, you are done.
I have a reasonably simple personal economy and it takes me all of five minutes to file my taxes in Sweden. My parents have a much more complicated setup (small private business, own a couple of properties, several deductions, etc.) and it basically is pretty straight-forward for them as well, certainly they don't need an accountant.
TurboTax, Intuit and anti-tax Republicans has really fucked with the US expectation of how complicated taxes needs to be.
Yes, keep telling yourself they don't (for what it matters)
In fact if you get a W2 the IRS already have it
Just think what someone with a gazillion dollars, some trusts, and "charitable foundations" could do.
But if by law something needs to be known by the government: just go for it
A silly analogy: your medical info is private, but it's in your best interest that a condition like 'diabetic' or 'allergic to something' have a lower level of privacy
In 2021, I filed my 2020 taxes, and a few months later I get a letter from the IRS saying that I owed $8000 because I forgot to report a large stock transaction. I owed $7000 + a $1000 fine.
I wasn't mad at all about the $7000, I definitely owed that and it was just an oversight on my end, these things happen, and I was able to get the fine lowered by calling the IRS [1], so that wasn't a huge deal .
What did annoy me was why do I have to do anything? If the IRS knows about the transaction and is able to complain about me not paying enough, that suggests that they already have the information that I'm sending them. Why make me buy software and copy information from a piece of paper into that software, just for the IRS to check it against the numbers that they already have?
I understand that you might need to issue corrections, and maybe the software should exist for something like that, but it doesn't seem like it should exist otherwise.
[1] Who at least in my case was actually really polite and helpful! I had heard horror stories but that was definitely not the case for me. The people I talked to were very sympathetic and nice.
You mistakenly assume that simply knowing what is on the 1099-B form is sufficient to determine your tax on the gain. They don't know if you are married or single or head of household (filing status) in the current tax year. They don't know what some of your itemized deductions and other income not reported to them might be (which in turn, along with filing status, determines what marginal tax bracket you are in). They don't know if you are actually just a nominee for someone else's income. These are just a few examples. They don't know any of this stuff until you tell them by filing your complete return.
I think you're misinterpreting the GP's point. Clearly, at least in our current system, it is essential to tell the IRS the parts of the return that they don't already know such as what are your expenses, deductions, marital status, etc.
But the absurd thing is that the capture of the IRS by the paid tax prep scammers has prevented them from simply showing you what's on your tax transcripts and having you click "Agree" or "Modify" for each one. Instead, you get your own copy of the 1099-B, 1099-DIV, 1099-INTs, and are administered a pointless "honesty test" to see if you'll type in the same numbers they have, or be automatically punished.
Obviously, Direct File was ideally situated to offer this feature since IRS has the data themselves, and simply populating the numbers is a highly efficient way of ingesting the data into your return.
Under Biden, the IRS tried to make w2s and 1099s available. If you log into the IRS website with your information, you can download the w2s and 1099s the Service has in your name.
Antitax activists have fought these steps every step of the way because the less annoying tax filing is, the less people will buy their antitax arguments.
The IRS isn’t captured by these predatory tax preparers, Congress is. The IRS can’t do a lot on data without Congress specifically authorizing it. And the Republican Party is in bed with the antitax activists who are in bed with the tax preparation companies.
Use Form 4506-T to request them.
(They can detect that you had a sale for which they got a 1099-B but you didn’t list on your Schedule D. That doesn’t mean they have enough information to fix it.)
Imagine pair programming with a tax lawyer. I'd rather eat my own hands.
https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/blob/9dd76a786ea69...
The giveaway is the Mono<T> return type.
I see the most of it stems from reactive-style programming (reactor.core.publisher.Mono).
Maybe they just tried to fit into one screen? Anyway I'd ask to simplify it, if I was a their team lead.
My experience with pretty much any Java framework ... It's sad because I do think (especially since Java 8) that Java is a great language for many things. But the community as this insane tendency to create incredibly convoluted pattern-on-top-of-pattern tooling.
I dislike Java but if it can get me back to the On Error Resume Next days I might reconsider.
Or if you’re in the business of selling extremely wide aspect ratio monitors.
After staring at code for 12 hours a day for a few decades my zoom is 125% by default.
But no, I don't think this would faze most Java devs. It's ugly and bad practice, but more or less acceptable depending on personal taste. It works, at least.
Point of interest: LLMs tend to go too far in the opposite direction with code like this. They will break everything apart into functions or classes, even trivial one-line lambdas. I find that even more obnoxious than the monstrosity you linked.
0: https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/tree/main/docs/des...
>But as I told the team as the end closed in, “We took a pipedream, and made it a policy choice.” No one can claim with a straight face that Direct File is impossible anymore; bringing it back requires only that our elected leaders make a different choice.
>What I mourn the most, though, is the dissolution of the team, the disregard for the vast impact they were poised and eager to deliver. The team itself is what I am proudest of from my time working on Direct File. Their manic dedication to the mission. The care they consistently took to get it right. The trust and love they had for each other.
https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file
Well yes, this is in essence what tax return preparation software has always been; The end result is a completed set of values to fill into the boxes of form 1040 (and whatever additional forms are deemed to be required), which can then be filed electronically or written/printed on paper to be returned at an office or by mail.
It's also fun that, because this is from the US, they can't just use CC0, but instead need to clarify that this must be public domain, separately from the worldwide CC0.
Less snarkily, I do wonder about the discrepancy there.
Creative Commons is a worldwide organization, not a jurisdiction-specfic organization. Creative Commons does not have the authority to harmonize laws worldwide.
https://creativecommons.org/public-domain/pdm/
https://creativecommons.org/public-domain/cc0/
PS: AFAIK, however, Authorship rights are different from Copyright, and cannot be given/passed as Copyrights, at least in US.
Also it's important to remember these works are not in the public domain because someone declared them to be, they are simply because they are works carried out by the US government. Similar to how copyright is automatic, it's not applied only when you put the copyright symbol, that's just informational.
> Not all source code, documentation and metadata used in the development of Direct File is included in this repository. Specifically, any code or data that is considered Personally Identifiable Information (PII), Federal Tax Information (FTI), Sensitive But Unclassified (SBU), or source code developed for National Security Systems (NSS), as defined in 40 U.S.C. § 11103, is exempt. Due to these restrictions, certain pieces of functionality have been removed or rewritten.
Very curious about what these pieces are that were removed
what do you propose they do, being entirely out of power?
Without this engagement, even if it's just futile noisemaking, the voters will surely think in the next election cycle "why should we vote for you, when you haven't done anything the last 2 years?"
I have seen Dems constantly attacking Trump, if you haven't consider the news you consume may simply be different. There is not one mainstream to push anymore.
as for the "mainstream social media", I'm not sure how effective the instagrams, tiktoks, etc. are at delivering these messages. I know some congressmen on are on there. Perhaps not enough, though. Or perhaps they don't get how to reach their people.
Basically, the democrats want fighters. We're well past bi-partisan tasks where we should just faciliate any kind of bill that comes up. Because very few are reasonable.
Trump called and got Jan 6th.
Democrats called and nobody could be bothered to show up to vote.
In the House, or rather out of the house, they could get their media circus in 10,000% better shape than it is in right now, and consistently deliver a powerful, viral, troll-y, and savvy message about Trump, 8 times a day, across many different media environments.
I do agree that that is the biggest issue in both DNC and RNC though. There's been a clear divide between what DNC wants to run and what the actual democrats want out of the party. Polls suggest from the latter that Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (AOC) is one of the biggest role models of a proper opponent in 2028, but it's been clear the DNC has been fighting against that for almost a decade now, for a variety of reasons.
RNC has a similar issue, once Trump is gone. There's already cracks forming in various different interests of republicans, but they all loosely rally around Trump. If/when Trump kicks the bucket, I don't see who can hold that cult of personality. Vance has very low charisma, and Mike Johnson seems too establishment (for voters that very much voted against establishment). I don't really see a protégé that is carrying whatever that MAGA mindset people want out of the movement.
There's a pretty easy way to reconcile this - run a fair primary election. Rigging it against Sanders in 2016, and not running one at all in 2024, both expectedly led to disaster. You're never gonna win if you don't even have the full support of your own party.
[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Democratic_Party_presid...
I'm sure Democrats can complain about their Senators in the same language.
> The Inflation Reduction Act (IRA) was signed into law in August 2022.1 Section 10301(1)(B) of the IRS provided the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) with $15 million to establish a task force to design an IRS-run, free direct electronic filing (e-file) system commonly referred to as “Direct File” ...
https://www.tigta.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2025-03/20...
You're bringing up an unrelated law that didn't even exist at the time of the launch of Direct File in early 2024.
[0] https://github.com/IRS-Public
[1] https://github.com/irsgov
IRS Direct File - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44131901 - May 2025 (62 comments)
It's too bad the current Administration is going to kill DirectFile and has fired all the people who were working on it.
This probably wouldn't apply to the "initial commit" problem, but I almost always use fixup instead of amend, ex:
Unlike amend, you can target an older commit rather than just the very-most-recent (great if you're separating the rename/refactor from the rewrite) and you can delay the second step of actually changing history until you're sure stuff is in a good state.This is particularly useful for the review process: All the changes during the review process can be "fixup" commits, allowing reviewers to easily see what did (or didn't) change since their last interaction. At the same time, all the fiddly fixes and back-and-forth stuff won't be in the final history, only a smaller number of "real" commits that future maintainers would care about.
https://github.com/git/git/commit/b4019f045646b1770a80394da8...
So it's adding an extra $240B in deficit per year (on top of an already ~6-7% of GDP deficit).
Where are you finding that quote, I don't see it on the Direct File homepage [0]
EDIT: Ah, I see now, it was from paxys's original post [1], I assumed it was meant to be an official quote from the IRS somewhere.
0: https://directfile.irs.gov/
1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44183593
> For the 2024 tax season yes. Funding bill removes it for 2025 onward.
Disbanding 18F was a crime. This made it abundantly clear that the E doesn't stand for efficiency.
Of course, this page doesn't include the $1M inauguration donation, so it's still incomplete.
Listing every config language and a few lines of CI or whatever scripts shit is misleading.
I see nothing other than typical boring enterprise/big gov crap here (which is fine, and expected).
Presumably, any Intuit competitors will be given a 10 year headstart worth many millions, maybe billions?
I'm doing it all by hand because I'm tired of going through the 'free' apps and entering in all my details, and when I get ready to file it end up being hundreds of dollars to file since the other forms (extra 1040 schedules, 2555, etc) are not included.
It is pre-filled with the known incomes so for the best majority of people filling their taxes is a 1 minute exercise.
This also helps, I guess, to have the taxes flow in.
Secondly, there is the issue of State / Local taxes - the IRS only receives federal tax data making it hard to automatically fill out the whole tax return since efiling products tend to file federal / state taxes together.
This year, direct file allowed people to import their W2s and 1099-INTs automatically based on the information the IRS had: https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/blob/main/direct-f...
additionally, the US has (one of?) the most complex tax systems in the world. In part b/c most of it is carve outs...on behalf of various lobbyist groups / catering to specific voting blocks.
The majority of the population of the US claims the standard deduction and has all their income in the form of W2 or 1099 which is reported to the IRS by the employer. Those people can be served by a return free filing system.
The minority which have more complicated taxes can still file like they do today. But even adding on investment income and housing related deductions the IRS likely has enough information to calculate what is owed.
We shouldn’t let perfect be the enemy of better. I know you weren’t arguing that point but just because the tax code is complex doesn’t mean it is complex for everyone’s situation
[1] https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xtyyMPczy6nuj_QR4Jy4J8sf8f3...
https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/blob/main/direct-f...
Ask anyone in the EU who has lived in one country and earned a paycheck from a different one.
Anyways, give it time, the EU is currently working to make it's tax system more complicated to solve some of the long standing continental issues, and to make the EU system more like the US one.
Public Domain means you can legally take their code, riddle it with malware, and distribute, claiming that's the real and true Direct File source code, and you are its author. What you do with malware is a different legal issue of course.
So I'm not sure proving you are commit owner by signing it is really helpful if anyone can do it as well, and there's no copyright holder to decide who's right.
Let's say you see a green checkmark on GitHub that confirms the commit was really made by GitHub user @totally_legit_government_absolutely_not_hacker.
Unless you already have their public GPG key in your private keychain, and you marked it as "trusted" previously, there's not really much more info to that.
UPDATE: besides, the government is like a million people, some of them are malicious actors.
If the Biden administration wanted to break the tax software oligopoly, they should have focused on making the government’s own interfaces open.
Guys I knew it
Here's to hoping they can outcompete TurboTax so brutally that Intuit won't be able to pay for all those lobbyists anymore.
> Releasing Direct File’s source code demonstrates that the IRS is fulfilling its obligations under the SHARE IT Act[1] (three weeks ahead of schedule!).
[1] https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/9566
And yes, "As a work of the US Government" it is dedicated to the Public Domain by law.
I doubt contributions are welcome
ITT: WhAt if "the administration" (we don't speak his name) tries to prevent us from using it.
Guys, Trump isn't anti- everything you like. He doesn't give a crap about open source.
• The Trump administration is preparing to sign into law a new budget that orders the immediate termination of the Direct File program (see SEC. 112207 "TASK FORCE ON THE TERMINATION OF DIRECT FILE").
• 18F, the agency within the federal government probably most responsible for championing and promoting open source development (and just all-around providing good digital services at a significantly lower cost), was eliminated by the Trump administration in March.
I know that you are probably a busy person, like many of us here; Still, I would encourage you to take some time each week to become informed about what is (or isn't) happening in politics rather than just offering knee-jerk reactions based on partisan feelings. It really is important.
It's not a boogie-man, Trump really does just suck. He's anti like, anything even good-adjacent.
When can we have "code is law"? Write the code as source of truth and generate the law from it.
but the actual tax definitions that deal with facts and derived calculation are here: https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/tree/main/direct-f...
See for example the standard deduction and tax rate calculations https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/blob/main/direct-f... https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/blob/main/direct-f...
I imagine these are based on the MeF (Modernized e-File) schemas because the system needs to transform the input data into XML MeF schemas to submit electronically to the MeF system (See https://www.irs.gov/e-file-providers/modernized-e-file-mef-s...)
[1] https://github.com/IRS-Public/direct-file/blob/main/direct-f... [2] https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/rp-14-41.pdf
https://chrisgiven.com/2025/05/direct-file-on-github/
Journalism is labor
I hate and block ads, since they literally screw up the functioning of the page now, so I don't think they should "just have ads and be open" -- but I think expecting average non-journalists to sign up for subscriptions to multiple "national newspapers" and a half dozen news magazines is absurd, which is why people here don't like paywalls, and bypass them wherever possible.