If RFK Jr says it's true, that's how I know it isn't. They go to great lengths to point out they're "using gold-standard science", which also makes me certain they aren't. They can't be, because none of this is about autism or science, it's about pushing their political agenda.
y-curious · 2h ago
While you're probably right in the outcome, you probably shouldn't argue based on the genetic fallacy[1]
> If RFK Jr says it's true, that's how I know it isn't.
And one of the reasons you don't let morons take over your party is that if they ever are right, they won't be believed. If these are actual risks with Tylenol then oops, that take is being lumped in with the antivax hysteria.
stuaxo · 3h ago
Why is he so against medicine?
sixothree · 8m ago
That's how he got where he is today.
CharlesW · 2h ago
Because that stance has been very beneficial for him financially and politically, ever since his pivot from legitimate and respected environmental lawyer to anti-vaxxer. He transitioned after receiving incredibly positive feedback for amplifying conspiratorial narratives while riding the coattails of the infamous "thimerosal causes autism" panic of the 2000s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deadly_Immunity
Spivak · 2h ago
Which is what? Lots of this admin's actions have made sense once you know the underlying agenda—thanks project 2025 for spelling a lot of it out—but this one has me baffled. Taking on the woke… tylenol industry?
avalys · 2h ago
It’s simple, RFKj is a well-intentioned idiot.
Spivak · 2h ago
Looking around for sources from before the world ended I can find quite a few reputable studies that show the correlation. The effect size is small ~0.4% in absolute risk but statistically detectable. Like okay, sure. Doctors already tell pregnant women to limit NSAIDs. So… we keep doing that. Mission accomplished?
ekianjo · 4h ago
> that's how I know it isn't.
Until you have a controlled study on pregnant women who use and don't use the drug, you won't really know for sure.
jeroenhd · 53m ago
Until we have a controlled study, we don't really know if using nouns causes autism either. We don't know what causes autism so everything is suspect.
News articles seem to state that the conclusions are clear as day but the same websites were equally sure of the opposite last year.
I'll wait or reliable sources of medical information, which the US government no longer is, to comment on these papers rather than assume whatever paper made the HN frontpage last is the final result of the scientific debate.
susiecambria · 3h ago
Not specific to tylenol and autism, but I think important: RFK Jr. will be issuing findings using "gold-standard science" and hold up the findings as definitive (as proof, etc.) at the same time that he completely minimizes and bemoans current scientific processes. While we may be able to tell the difference between RFK's BS science and real science, what does this mean for everyone else? Especially because RFK Jr. does not trust science?
spchampion2 · 4h ago
Judging from the comments I've seen, nobody believes this because RFK has completely shot his credibility, and I don't blame them either.
But it turns out there may actually be some emerging evidence to support this. This recent Harvard meta-analysis [1] from just last month looked at 46 different studies and suggested that there may actually be something happening here although it's not conclusive. Correlation but not yet causation.
Nobody should be making policy on this yet, but it's the kind of thing that I would allocate some research dollars to if I hadn't just fired all of the competent researchers.
That is a retrospective meta study, which leads to lots of speculation, but little actual proof of causation.
>> The researchers noted that while steps should be taken to limit acetaminophen use, the drug is important for treating maternal fever and pain, which can also harm children.
also:
>> Baccarelli noted in the “competing interests” section of the paper that he has served as an expert witness for a plaintiff in a case involving potential links between acetominophen use during pregnancy and neurodevelopmental disorders.
Huh, but digging in a little more does show some stronger studies... hmmmm...
I read the study and TBH it's more or less expected that a correlation would exist between increased NDD diagnoses and prescriptions common to pregnant women in regions with increased NDD diagnoses.
Being afforded better care during pregnancy should correlate with better attention (and diagnosis of conditions) to offspring.
If one were cynical one might say this was a good call by Andrea Baccarelli, the Dean of the Faculty, to commission a meta study looking for correlations between common treatments and NDD diagnoses in the current climate of funding going toward whomever can put forward a thread to follow in pursuit of autism.
John23832 · 4h ago
This man says everything causes autism.
more_corn · 4h ago
Woah, what if EVERYTHING causes autism?!
barbazoo · 4h ago
everything This man says causes autism.
mountainriver · 1h ago
It’s insane that the RFK crowd continues to not consider that the increase is just due to better diagnoses.
I wouldn’t entirely rule out there being environmental factors, but from the data I could gather it seems that acetaminophen usage has decreased in pregnancy over the last several decades in the US, while autism has increased.
This all seems to go back to the boomer generation believing the world was simpler when they grew up and that it was somehow ruined. That may be true about some things but the reality of their generation is they had no idea what people were going through, and didn’t have the language to describe it
adamredwoods · 3h ago
RFKjr is disgusting. He is a QUACK, and not a medical professional. He is a danger to the welfare of all people.
1: https://www.scribbr.co.uk/fallacy/the-genetic-fallacy/#:~:te...
And one of the reasons you don't let morons take over your party is that if they ever are right, they won't be believed. If these are actual risks with Tylenol then oops, that take is being lumped in with the antivax hysteria.
Until you have a controlled study on pregnant women who use and don't use the drug, you won't really know for sure.
https://news.ki.se/no-link-between-paracetamol-use-during-pr... concludes that there is no link between acetaminophen and autism based on existing research. https://ehjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12940-... concludes the opposite. I'm not qualified to determine which of these studies is more reliable, but the evidence is far from clear if multiple literature studies state the opposite conclusion.
News articles seem to state that the conclusions are clear as day but the same websites were equally sure of the opposite last year.
I'll wait or reliable sources of medical information, which the US government no longer is, to comment on these papers rather than assume whatever paper made the HN frontpage last is the final result of the scientific debate.
But it turns out there may actually be some emerging evidence to support this. This recent Harvard meta-analysis [1] from just last month looked at 46 different studies and suggested that there may actually be something happening here although it's not conclusive. Correlation but not yet causation.
Nobody should be making policy on this yet, but it's the kind of thing that I would allocate some research dollars to if I hadn't just fired all of the competent researchers.
1 - https://hsph.harvard.edu/news/using-acetaminophen-during-pre...
>> The researchers noted that while steps should be taken to limit acetaminophen use, the drug is important for treating maternal fever and pain, which can also harm children.
also:
>> Baccarelli noted in the “competing interests” section of the paper that he has served as an expert witness for a plaintiff in a case involving potential links between acetominophen use during pregnancy and neurodevelopmental disorders.
Huh, but digging in a little more does show some stronger studies... hmmmm...
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6822099/
Being afforded better care during pregnancy should correlate with better attention (and diagnosis of conditions) to offspring.
If one were cynical one might say this was a good call by Andrea Baccarelli, the Dean of the Faculty, to commission a meta study looking for correlations between common treatments and NDD diagnoses in the current climate of funding going toward whomever can put forward a thread to follow in pursuit of autism.
I wouldn’t entirely rule out there being environmental factors, but from the data I could gather it seems that acetaminophen usage has decreased in pregnancy over the last several decades in the US, while autism has increased.
This all seems to go back to the boomer generation believing the world was simpler when they grew up and that it was somehow ruined. That may be true about some things but the reality of their generation is they had no idea what people were going through, and didn’t have the language to describe it
Tylenol and autism, lacks any proof:
https://www.reuters.com/legal/lawsuits-claiming-tylenol-caus...
https://www.acog.org/news/news-articles/2021/09/response-to-...
If he really wants to help autism, why not fund schools and programs to help existing people with this neuro-divergency? Where is that effort?
Oh, wait, he is slashing other efforts to fund his own:
https://nevadaautism.com/rfk-jr-slashing-traditional-autism-...
Disgusting!
How much are people willing to bet that the incidence of autism will remain unchanged and the administration will disavow everything.
“Nobody knew autism was so complicated.” — future Trump, probably.