Link should be changed to this from the current blogslop
KerrAvon · 11h ago
for anyone else looking for tl;dr on WTF KDB actually is, it's buried in the AI slop marketing text in the blog announcement: "KDB-X is […] both a programming language and a database."
Kx released a 32bit, free-for-commercial-use version in 2014 and then reversed course around a year later after banks and hedge funds surprised them by flocking to it for a large subset of their developers / dev machines.
Hopefully they stick to it this time around. It's an incredible system. It's the only thing I've ever used, including Pandas, dplyr & Matlab, where someone could stand over my shoulder asking data analysis questions and I could answer them, on the fly.
LLM's, though notoriously bad (so far) at KDB+/Q compared to other languages, are still a godsend for folks getting started. I recently returned to writing Q after being away from it for 8 years and I've been amazed how good even Google's AI suggestions have been at helping with functions & queries.
Getting started tip: try using Q strictly as a query language, avoid K. Do everything else (data shoveling, devops,...) with a different language.
0cf8612b2e1e · 8h ago
Could you give an example of where it shines? I have had to answer many a SQL/pandas question with someone over my shoulder, so curious where you see the sharpest benefit.
Admittedly, I am unlikely to learn this proprietary DSL, but always good to know what is the best tool for a job.
AUnterrainer · 8h ago
Q is not just a query language or a database. It's an array programming language with database capability. You can build an entire framework with just Q, from real-time streaming, to in memory database to on disk database. You can build all APIs and business logic around it. Because it's vector oriented and in memory it's faster than pretty much everything else, no loops required. I have seen a team of 15 KDB developers build what would require an entire etrading department of 200+ developers
leprechaun1066 · 8h ago
Given Wes McKinney created Pandas for quantitative analysis, it's possible that Pandas wouldn't exist if AQR were paying for a q license.
alyandon · 11h ago
I just tried to install the community edition and it fails claiming the license key generated by the site is invalid. Not a great onboarding experience.
steveBK123 · 9h ago
do you have a previous community edition installed?
I ran into this than scanned up and saw some warnings about clearing your environment vars & re-sourcing your profile so it no longer points to the old QLIC/QHOME
alyandon · 8h ago
Nope - fresh install.
fidotron · 11h ago
> A quick look at the product licensing page reveals that KDB-X gives you up to 16GB of RAM, 4 secondary threads per process, and 8 IPC connections.
willvarfar · 11h ago
It also says it is not for production use.
quantdev0 · 9h ago
I see 'KDB-X is not yet intended for production use' in multiple places, presumably due to the preview nature of the software.
kanungle · 8h ago
Yes it says the preview is not intended for production. Once it exits preview there's nothing saying it can't be used in prod
bfm · 10h ago
TL;DR TOS
Summary of the KX Community Edition License Agreement:
Key Points:
What you get:
- Free license to use KX software for personal or internal business purposes only
- No support or maintenance services included
- Software provided "as is" without warranties
Major restrictions:
- NO commercial use
- Cannot sell, distribute, or monetize any product that uses or depends on this software
- Cannot bundle it with commercial products
- Cannot reverse engineer, modify, or create derivative works
- Cannot remove copyright notices or trademarks
- Software may phone home to verify valid license
Important limitations:
- KX's liability capped at $100
- They disclaim all warranties including fitness for purpose
- You must delete software if agreement terminates
- Subject to export control laws
- KX can audit your compliance
Legal terms:
- Governed by New York law
- You retain no IP rights in the software
- Confidentiality obligations for 5 years
- KX can terminate at any time
Bottom line:
This is a restrictive free license meant for evaluation/personal use only. Any commercial use or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you need commercial rights, you'll need a different license.
mianos · 2h ago
Just adding, this is completely the opposite to what the original blogspam article says. I think the references to the "Poisoned Chalice", should be updated to replace Macbeth with KX. The promise, (and delivery) of a hyper efficient way to analyse data that kdb/q gives you will always lead to final regret.
unixhero · 2h ago
What is the threshold before having to buy a commercial license?
latenightcoding · 11h ago
With the rise of LLM-coding do these specialized/niche languages lose their edge? (i.e: prototyping speed, job security, etc)
AUnterrainer · 11h ago
No LLM can write KDB yet
pinewurst · 11h ago
As most KDB code is proprietary, one wonders if there's even enough available code to train/steal from.
AUnterrainer · 8h ago
KDB code is as proprietary as java, python, C++ code found at other financial institutions. What's proprietary is the Q language. not the code you write with it
resoluteteeth · 2h ago
I think what they mean is that there is less publicly available kdb code for llms to be trained on
coredog64 · 10h ago
No "public" LLM can write KDB yet.
therein · 11h ago
In this case it is a little beyond specialized and niche. It is right to left too.
So, klong for prototyping, and a libre build of 'j' for everything else.
unixhero · 2h ago
When does this cost money now?
Quitschquat · 9h ago
What would be the closest open-source equivalent for this? Influx?
secwang · 1m ago
klongpy
AUnterrainer · 9h ago
There's nothing that gets close to KDB. You can build an entire framework with just KDB
alt187 · 8h ago
OP cleverly avoided your question by hallucinating one about what could be done with KBD, but yeah.
Influx is basically the same niche.
optymizer · 10h ago
What a confusing website. The website is named 'defcon', like the famous defense conference. What does 'defcon' have to do with Q? What even is Q?
The landing page is uninformative. No explanation of what Q is. References ticks, doesn't mention what these are.
The About page is filled with generic words and no substance - so much fluff.
I couldn't tell if KDB-X is an exploit database for Defcon participants, or some other kind of specialized database, and at this point I'm so disappointed by this presentation that I lost interest in whatever this piece of software is or does.
Luckily someone else on HN figured it out and commented with a TLDR, but I'd use this site as an example of how not to design websites.
kristjansson · 9h ago
It’s a pretty terrible secondary source, BUT
The topic is clearly of interest to the community, and isn’t half the fun of HN learning about things other people are interested in, from the sources they deem acceptable? Why would you only want to read things that are immediately and totally legible to you, specifically?
papercrane · 10h ago
> The website is named 'defcon', like the famous defense conference.
Both the defense conference and this are references to the military term DEFCON, that stands for "defense readiness condition". Q here is referring to the Q programming language that is built on top of KDB's K language.
The website is a blog and learning resource for the Q language.
AUnterrainer · 10h ago
Thanks. Looks like at least someone could follow my thought process
- Blog announcement: https://kx.com/blog/introducing-kdb-x-public-preview/
- Product landing page: https://kx.com/products/introducing-kdb-x-public-preview/
https://code.kx.com/q4m3/0_Overview/
Hopefully they stick to it this time around. It's an incredible system. It's the only thing I've ever used, including Pandas, dplyr & Matlab, where someone could stand over my shoulder asking data analysis questions and I could answer them, on the fly.
LLM's, though notoriously bad (so far) at KDB+/Q compared to other languages, are still a godsend for folks getting started. I recently returned to writing Q after being away from it for 8 years and I've been amazed how good even Google's AI suggestions have been at helping with functions & queries.
Getting started tip: try using Q strictly as a query language, avoid K. Do everything else (data shoveling, devops,...) with a different language.
Admittedly, I am unlikely to learn this proprietary DSL, but always good to know what is the best tool for a job.
I ran into this than scanned up and saw some warnings about clearing your environment vars & re-sourcing your profile so it no longer points to the old QLIC/QHOME
Summary of the KX Community Edition License Agreement:
Key Points:
What you get:
- Free license to use KX software for personal or internal business purposes only
- No support or maintenance services included
- Software provided "as is" without warranties
Major restrictions:
- NO commercial use
- Cannot sell, distribute, or monetize any product that uses or depends on this software
- Cannot bundle it with commercial products
- Cannot reverse engineer, modify, or create derivative works
- Cannot remove copyright notices or trademarks
- Software may phone home to verify valid license
Important limitations:
- KX's liability capped at $100
- They disclaim all warranties including fitness for purpose
- You must delete software if agreement terminates
- Subject to export control laws
- KX can audit your compliance
Legal terms:
- Governed by New York law
- You retain no IP rights in the software
- Confidentiality obligations for 5 years
- KX can terminate at any time
Bottom line:
This is a restrictive free license meant for evaluation/personal use only. Any commercial use or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you need commercial rights, you'll need a different license.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44498766
So, klong for prototyping, and a libre build of 'j' for everything else.
Influx is basically the same niche.
The landing page is uninformative. No explanation of what Q is. References ticks, doesn't mention what these are.
The About page is filled with generic words and no substance - so much fluff.
I couldn't tell if KDB-X is an exploit database for Defcon participants, or some other kind of specialized database, and at this point I'm so disappointed by this presentation that I lost interest in whatever this piece of software is or does.
Luckily someone else on HN figured it out and commented with a TLDR, but I'd use this site as an example of how not to design websites.
The topic is clearly of interest to the community, and isn’t half the fun of HN learning about things other people are interested in, from the sources they deem acceptable? Why would you only want to read things that are immediately and totally legible to you, specifically?
Both the defense conference and this are references to the military term DEFCON, that stands for "defense readiness condition". Q here is referring to the Q programming language that is built on top of KDB's K language.
The website is a blog and learning resource for the Q language.